EXPERIENCE 194 | Building Predictable Systems for Growth and Pushing Through Revenue Plateaus - A Conversation with Brian Kerlin, Founder and CEO of Optitude and Creator of the Optitude Growth Academy

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Let's have some fun.

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Welcome to the Low Cove Experience Podcast.

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On this show, you'll get to know business and community leaders from all around Northern Colorado and beyond.

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Our guests share their stories, business stories, life stories, stories of triumph and of tragedy, and through it all you'll be inspired and entertained.

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These conversations are real and raw and no topics are off limits.

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So pop in a breath mint and get ready to meet our latest guest.

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Welcome to the Low Cove Experience Podcast.

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Welcome to the Welcome back to the loco experience podcast.

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My guest today is Brian Kurland and Brian is the founder and CEO of Optitude.

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Hey Kurt.

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Thanks.

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Appreciate you having me, man.

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Thanks for making time.

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Yeah.

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It's great to be here.

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You're uh, you're in the foothills outside of Boulder or something.

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Is that what I remember you saying?

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No, no, we're in Denver.

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Yeah.

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We're in Denver proper.

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Okay.

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Yeah.

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In Denver proper, not too far from, um, Wash Park.

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Okay.

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Platte Park area.

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So you get a long drive back home after this.

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Yeah.

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I'll be, uh, I like, uh, we come to Fort Collins a bunch for, uh, client work.

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So I'm, uh, I'm up here today for that.

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And then I have a dinner tonight, so I'm a big fan of Fort Collins.

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Yeah.

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So, so you can have more than one margarita if you want to.

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Going to dinner after this anyway.

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Anything's, yeah, anything's possible.

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We're only a couple, I think a couple blocks from Main Street, right?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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You could easy walk there.

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Yeah.

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You leave your car parked here, get home later.

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Perfect.

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Yeah.

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So, um, for listeners that haven't heard about aptitude, do you wanna just give us a quick, uh, description of.

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What y'all do?

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Sure.

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Yeah.

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Thank you.

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Um, Optitude was, was founded, uh, almost seven years ago, a little over six and a half, uh, 2018.

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And, uh, the purpose of fat of the founding of the company, uh, was really to focus on helping second stage companies between 1 million and 10 million.

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Build a more predictable system for growth.

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So build their capacity for growth.

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And what that really means is, um, how do they take.

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Uh, business as the founder of an existing business, take themselves and replicate the process of acquiring new customers or essentially growing from a revenue standpoint, um, and doing it in a predictable way.

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And we founded the company with helping solve problems, mostly for professional service firms or serve or firms that have expertise that they're selling a service or plumbers or, but also consultants, things like that, engineers.

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Yeah.

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Engineers, it consultants, marketing agencies, more white collar professional services.

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When I gotcha.

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Yeah, exactly.

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And the reason is because those individuals that started their company or started their firm, uh, have an expertise in their particular field, but didn't.

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And not often have a particular expertise in growing their business.

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How do I acquire new customers except the relationship that I have with people that referrals.

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And that's only goes so far.

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And then that kind of plateaus, it's like the, the charisma.

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And the capabilities of that, of that founder, creator, uh, takes it so far.

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And then now you're plateaued because nobody else can really make it rain.

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Yeah, you got it.

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That's a great way to describe it.

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Like we just, we talk about that challenge is you start as a rainmaker and the rainmaker or the founder, the CEO is, or the principal, whatever the term is used in that particular firm.

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They get to a certain point and then they want to go, um, you know, bring out other people to help expand the business, but they've never really systematized it, never built a process.

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And so unfortunately they've, we've heard some horror stories.

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They go out and hire some people in the, in a particular role and they don't have that figured out behind the scenes in this particular role.

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These individuals come in and they usually fall flat.

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Usually they're not prepared to sell it because it isn't prepared for somebody else to sell it.

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Bingo.

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Definitely a challenge I've found with, with Loco Think Tank.

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Um, you know, we've talked about it a little bit before, but just like one of the challenges for me is if I had a sales rep out there selling Loco Think Tank, well, they're going to think everybody's a good fit for Loco Think Tank, but not everybody is, you know?

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And so there's this potential.

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Instant tension between me and my sales rep.

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Cause if I don't let somebody into my club or they don't make it into a chapter, well, then I was taking food off the table of this salesperson.

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Yeah, totally.

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And so, yeah, anyway, have you had that experience?

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I mean, cause it's, it's common.

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There's a, there's somebody hired at some point in the growth of that organization.

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And then there is this conflict that happens to that individual and the, uh, Lightly, I mean, I think when we first really got connected, it was about this time last year.

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And at that time I was hiring a, a business development person.

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And, and yeah, a couple of the first people that he thought were a great fit for membership at local think tank.

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Once I connected, I was like, they're like a minority owner.

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Like, they're not even the decider for the business.

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Like, Oh, but the decider is he's not even active.

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Well, the There's still the decider, you know, and so we just had some, you know, immediate friction and then it was like, well, why am I even going to go try to sell this if you're going to say no?

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Yeah.

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And so it's an interesting thing, but I guess that's everybody, right?

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Like whether it's a architecture firm or, you know, not every customer is for every.

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Oh, yeah.

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Nail in the head.

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I mean, we talk about it, um, in the programs we offer in the, in the consulting we do is that it's a term probably people have heard a lot, a lot in business building is that at this stage of company, uh, that we work with is second, second stage is do they really have a defined ideal customer, ideal customer profile?

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A lot of times the answer we get is no, that there's this figment of whom it is that they want to serve.

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But then we like to believe like there's a whole set of other layers underneath it.

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That ideal is something that you can replicate from a previous customer that you've have, and then understand the nuances about what are the real problems?

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What are the, keeps them up at night?

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Can you define that individual?

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For example, we, um, uh, had a recent client we worked with that they built not only their ideal customer, they, they, they legitimized it by having a first name, that the, it was a design firm, the individual, they refer to it, uh, that individual as Mary and Mary is a, um, lead, Kind of, I guess, I guess you'd say a lead of a, um, independent, uh, kind of housing community and that individual manages the entire community.

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This was their customer.

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And so Mary had a particular set of problems and Mary's problems were about.

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Uniqueness of the environment that we're going to design for Mary and for the people that lived in that community.

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This is like a older living community or something along that line.

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Yeah, you got it.

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So she's got like 60 rooms or something to buy design stuff from if she likes it.

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And she's very motivated to have current edgy designs because that's how Mary can sell that property over the period.

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Other ones.

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You got it.

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How do you differentiate?

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How do you kind of understand that?

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And Mary was stuck with the fact that first of all, who was her competition?

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What kept her up at night is, well, you, you hinted to one of the things, well, how do I get residents to join and be a part of this community?

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Um, but this, this design firm worked very diligently to figure out.

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What are all those particular nuances?

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And then that ideal customer is more defined.

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So when they quote unquote show up at the front door as a potential client, they can be very black and white to be objective as, is it a potential customer for us?

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And that's just not the work that most, firms that level have done, they tend to get to a certain level and then they, they think they have an adult customer, but that work really is the next stage.

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How did you get interested in this particular niche?

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If you will, um, did you work in firms that got stuck at that million dollar range or something and finally conquered it or like really curious?

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My background.

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Yeah.

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I guess in a lot of ways I've been in business development and sales for almost two and a half decades.

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Okay.

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So I mean, it's my expertise.

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You're older than you look, right?

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Oh, thanks.

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I appreciate that.

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It's always good to be in that stage where you hit the ground where like.

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How old?

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How old?

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You know, so, so, uh, I feel good about that.

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It's probably jeans.

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My Irish jeans.

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There you go.

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Uh, but yeah.

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So because I had so much background in it, I've, I'm passionate about, I think revenue is the lifeblood of any organization.

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And the only way you generate revenue is to acquire new customers or new clients or new, you know, new, uh, new members, depending on what your business is.

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So number one, I understand from that perspective.

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The second is you've got to be able to build that process.

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And then what I did in my second or third phase of my career, and that's, and that was build teams that were selling and how do you align those individuals to accomplish those goals for organizations.

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And then lucky enough through my friend group, and now my wife, Um, there's a lot of entrepreneurs that I've, uh, become friends with, including, I said, I man, uh, married now, a now wife at the time was my girlfriend, uh, had been an entrepreneur and still is for almost two decades.

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And I watched her go through that exact same challenge.

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Is she in the professional services space too?

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She is.

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Okay.

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And so it was very clear to me, uh, watching her with her, her level of expertise.

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Uh, figure out how to navigate to a certain level.

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And then for moments in time, realized the frustration, she could not see her dream become reality, which is building something very, um, unique in a marketplace and grow significantly to have the kind of impact she and her team does, uh, wants to do.

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And, you know, it became so easy for me to get excited about it because, you know, one is my wife and two is like, Hey, listen, if I can help her solve that problem.

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Then it'll help unlock her opportunity for her future dreams.

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So you were working at some other job kind of thing while she's kind of struggling to scale, turn that corner from one to whatever million and kind of thing.

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And, and did you start building the toolkit then?

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Did you work together on the problem or just?

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You just watched her struggle.

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No, we worked together.

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Yeah, man.

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I mean, I don't know how it is in other people's married lives.

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Yeah, I absolutely would collaborated with her.

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Um, cause she, you know, again, she was an entrepreneur business owner before.

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I think it was, well, you had been a sales representative type, which is what she needed, but.

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What do those people need from her first?

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Exactly.

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And so I, we, we sat down and really worked through and talked about the challenge and how that challenge showed up for her and then, yeah, we started to script out, like, what are the tools?

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What are the processes?

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How do you create the checklists?

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And then through that, it started to expand to other people that were in my network that needed that same work and therefore founded Optitude to kind of do that more as a, as a business.

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Oh, so you were kind of doing some of this work as a, Uh, side hustle for a while, you know, built some tools that she could use.

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Exactly.

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Yeah, you can use this.

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That's right.

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Uh, were you, like, is this, uh, from scratch omelet, uh, or did you go through any kind of a coaching federation training or anything like that?

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Probably a little bit of this, a little bit of that, or?

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Yeah, no, I think it's, it's pretty much my own kind of education, I guess, self taught.

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A little batter game room up here kind of thing?

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Yeah, I guess.

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I meant.

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I probably had enough of two areas of expertise.

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One, the area of expertise relative to sales and business development, understanding sales process, understanding how to acquire customers, had so much of that knowledge and training through my previous, uh, business life.

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Sure.

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And then in, um, working with her and other founders and business owners, It was like, I think you just learn from helping people solve problems.

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Um, now clearly I've read a ton of books, you know, been a part of, um, mentor groups and, and those types of environments.

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Um, I, I was in the early days.

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Well, I don't know how early it was.

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I think it might've been 15 years into Denver startup week, uh, where I was down there.

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Someone Uh, turn me on to like, Hey, you should spend time in this community because this is how businesses get built.

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So, I guess I should say, in reference to that, I learned frameworks by going to mentor, um, groups.

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For example, there was an early, uh, group called 101010, um, a gentleman in Denver that started this group that brought in founders and CEOs to help them solve problems.

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Uh, big problems.

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Essentially the concept is try to figure out how to solve 10 problems in 10 days and create 10 companies, i.

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e.

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the 10, 10, 10 kind of thing.

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That was the moniker there.

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And then I was lucky enough to be able to go volunteer at, um, incubators and startup communities like Boomtown and right here in a sphere in Fort Collins.

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Just to get an understanding to your point, like what is the framework needed to start and build a business that is more systematic and programmatic versus ideas on a wall, put that out in the market and hope, you know, the hope strategy, which it doesn't really work.

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Um, and that's kind of where I started to foundationally build, uh, the tools for off the team.

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Um, Where did you pick the name?

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Yeah, good question.

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It's really a kind of amalgamation between Optumize, which is, you know, you think about a business getting to a certain level, you need to generate more consistent revenue and that's optimizing your ability to do that.

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And then we believe at Optitude, you also have to have the correct mindset.

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So an attitude, so optimize an attitude is Optitude.

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Um, because if, if a founder doesn't have the right attitude on understanding, they have to be a constant learner and ability to develop, uh, we can, we've noticed in our own business, it run into a lot of, a lot of roadblocks.

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So that's how we, that's how we developed the name.

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Um, And did I ask you this before, but have you, uh, connected with the true space people at all?

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Yeah, I definitely know, uh, the groups that work in kind of that same segment and with the same logic really is kind of, if you can predict your revenues and then execute, then you can grow your company.

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Yeah.

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I mean, there's, uh, there's a lot of companies in the space.

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Um, yeah, they kind of, they focus on that.

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I mean, I think the original framework, um, came from the Kauffman foundation.

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And just general, like, how do you build businesses or how to build, so started.

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Uh, but I am familiar with the true space group.

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They were a client of mine, uh, in my earliest days of building aptitude.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Um, so I'm fond of, well, yeah, cause they got to sell that and nobody knows what the hell they're selling.

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Yeah, I mean, Because it was kind of built on theory for a while, it seems, and now it's quite a framework and program that they've built, too.

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Yeah, they have a really, um, impressive framework.

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I don't know much about it.

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I just know a few folks that have been kind of through it or around it kind of thing.

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Yeah, I'm a big fan of what they've done, what I think they're continuing to do, um, They have, you know, build it around the concept of a ton of research, which I think is, uh, is fascinating.

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If you, if you get a chance, I think, uh, people that are in business building should definitely check out what they're doing and, and how they're, how they're doing it.

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Yeah.

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Um, would you like to like give away some free knowledge to listeners that maybe are finding themselves?

00:16:48.725 --> 00:17:04.875
space of growth has slowed because the founder is spread too thin, other than obviously call you and go through a, uh, a fitness program with aptitude kind of thing, but, um, is there some core principles that people should be thinking about at the heart of it?

00:17:04.994 --> 00:17:05.654
Yeah, I think so.

00:17:05.654 --> 00:17:24.680
I mean, our, I meant the foundation of how aptitude, uh, What started around the point of view of the inside up principle, the inside of principle has two major factors that you cannot, uh, the belief is you cannot grow a business consistently and predictably over time, unless you have consistent performance and consistent capacity growth.

00:17:25.130 --> 00:17:32.359
For example, if you only have performance as in you're generating revenue, you're increasing customer acquisition, you're starting to move people through the pipeline, et cetera.

00:17:32.740 --> 00:17:38.210
But the capacity of the business and the leader, the founder is not growing at the same pace.

00:17:38.819 --> 00:17:40.130
One will outpace the other.

00:17:40.220 --> 00:17:45.029
And when that usually happens, what it feels like inside of an organization is what people describe as chaotic.

00:17:45.690 --> 00:17:53.609
Is that the founder is trying to do the rainmaking, run the business, deliver the service, or a small group, small team of people are trying to do that.

00:17:54.930 --> 00:17:57.559
The performance starts to kind of outpace the capacity.

00:17:57.569 --> 00:18:02.750
And then it feels like maybe the wheels on the bus are starting to shake or, you know, you feel like you're going way too fast.

00:18:03.230 --> 00:18:04.250
You almost need a governor.

00:18:04.299 --> 00:18:05.009
If you know what I mean?

00:18:05.009 --> 00:18:05.960
Like control the speed.

00:18:05.970 --> 00:18:06.539
Yeah.

00:18:06.599 --> 00:18:09.190
So that's, that's kind of relative to performance, right?

00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:13.059
If those strategy systems and practices are not consistent.

00:18:14.144 --> 00:18:21.904
then you'll get to a challenge where the capacity, or excuse me, when the strategy system practices are consistent, but the capacity is not there, it'll feel uncomfortable.

00:18:22.414 --> 00:18:24.684
And so founders will feel like it's out of control.

00:18:24.724 --> 00:18:24.934
Yeah.

00:18:24.974 --> 00:18:25.134
Right?

00:18:25.134 --> 00:18:25.744
So that's one side.

00:18:25.795 --> 00:18:29.734
On the capacity side is that the founders, like I got it really organized.

00:18:29.944 --> 00:18:35.605
I have a little bit of the strategy system practices built, but I haven't figured out how to remove myself.

00:18:36.180 --> 00:18:38.970
From the situation, which is they're the bottleneck.

00:18:39.000 --> 00:18:43.829
What I mean by that is like, Oh, you know, like for example, maybe in your business, like, Oh gosh, everyone knows Kurt.

00:18:44.210 --> 00:18:45.809
So the referrals all go to Kurt.

00:18:45.819 --> 00:18:46.660
They all go through Kurt.

00:18:46.670 --> 00:18:47.890
Everyone wants to talk to Kurt.

00:18:47.910 --> 00:18:49.619
And I mean, let's be honest.

00:18:49.619 --> 00:18:50.740
I mean, I know you're superhuman.

00:18:50.740 --> 00:18:55.759
You're a lot of expertise, charismatic, lovely to look at and who doesn't want people to reach out.

00:18:55.759 --> 00:18:56.029
Yeah.

00:18:56.079 --> 00:18:56.390
Yeah.

00:18:56.400 --> 00:18:56.559
Yeah.

00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:56.849
Yeah.

00:18:56.869 --> 00:18:56.990
Yeah.

00:18:57.079 --> 00:18:57.980
Very, very flattery.

00:18:58.089 --> 00:18:58.640
Yeah, it is.

00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:01.140
Cause that's, I mean, it's obviously a big part of starting a business.

00:19:01.140 --> 00:19:02.859
You want to make a personal impact, but.

00:19:03.234 --> 00:19:06.654
When that happens, we see that, uh, capacity's there.

00:19:06.684 --> 00:19:07.545
It's starting to be there, but.

00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:11.130
The performance, et cetera, isn't, isn't consistent.

00:19:11.500 --> 00:19:14.119
And so one just has to happen at the same time as the other.

00:19:14.119 --> 00:19:15.509
We call it the inside out principle.

00:19:15.509 --> 00:19:17.119
They have to happen simultaneously.

00:19:17.250 --> 00:19:17.549
Okay.

00:19:17.559 --> 00:19:19.420
Performance and capacity have to grow together.

00:19:19.539 --> 00:19:22.259
Oh, and so all of our foundational work is built around that.

00:19:22.269 --> 00:19:24.990
So that's a few insights into our point of view.

00:19:25.000 --> 00:19:25.490
Fair enough.

00:19:25.664 --> 00:19:28.085
Um, but we, I, I can obviously share other things.

00:19:28.144 --> 00:19:28.434
Sure.

00:19:28.515 --> 00:19:28.734
Yeah.

00:19:28.755 --> 00:19:32.535
Well, I did, I, have we talked about my t shirt that I, that I gave to my members last year?

00:19:32.575 --> 00:19:33.375
No, tell me about it.

00:19:33.404 --> 00:19:38.664
Uh, it just says, I am the bottleneck on the front in the shape of a wine bottle.

00:19:38.855 --> 00:19:39.355
Is that right?

00:19:39.384 --> 00:19:41.605
Uh, yeah, upside down wine bottle looking thing.

00:19:41.605 --> 00:19:43.625
And then on the back it says, but I'm working on it.

00:19:44.275 --> 00:19:45.184
Loco Think Tank.

00:19:45.625 --> 00:19:46.095
That's so funny.

00:19:46.105 --> 00:19:48.714
You know, and we're not obviously nearly as programmatic.

00:19:48.714 --> 00:19:51.184
It's more about, you know, Solving the challenge in front of you.

00:19:51.184 --> 00:19:54.615
And some are, you know, there, some have figured it out and some have not.

00:19:54.694 --> 00:19:58.974
And so, uh, that's the hope, but we should definitely get you, uh, into some of our chapters.

00:19:58.984 --> 00:20:01.134
Cause sometimes we have a lot of the same philosophies.

00:20:01.954 --> 00:20:07.214
I've got lots of brains in a group and a good leader.

00:20:07.345 --> 00:20:07.545
Yeah.

00:20:07.545 --> 00:20:08.355
You've got lots of.

00:20:08.700 --> 00:20:16.210
Experience and concentration of kind of best practice on revenue team building and foundation building.

00:20:16.480 --> 00:20:17.170
Yeah, I'd be great.

00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:18.710
That's the main heart of your focus.

00:20:18.940 --> 00:20:25.039
Like operations and HR a little bit, but only as it goes to hiring the right people to go to.

00:20:25.609 --> 00:20:26.670
So you got it.

00:20:26.670 --> 00:20:26.970
Yeah.

00:20:26.970 --> 00:20:27.210
Yeah.

00:20:27.210 --> 00:20:34.769
We have our expertise in the business development sales process, um, strategies relative to growth from acquiring customers.

00:20:34.769 --> 00:20:35.829
That's our expertise.

00:20:36.369 --> 00:20:47.299
Um, but yeah, I think, I mean, I've, I'm a big fan, obviously what you and your, uh, your group have been doing, uh, from a distance, like I said, we got introduced to each other a little over a year ago, but learning more about.

00:20:47.950 --> 00:20:49.380
the community that you've built.

00:20:49.730 --> 00:21:01.009
I, and I'm always a fan, obviously that people that build communities around business owners, um, we have a, you know, a little bit of a smaller community relative to Optitude, but we, we have the same belief, right?

00:21:01.009 --> 00:21:15.835
Which is bringing like minded people together to work together that are, Um, trusted kind of entrepreneur colleagues or not in the same business, but just in the same, uh, mental framework, we're trying to get a special place in the world.

00:21:15.914 --> 00:21:16.634
It is right.

00:21:16.634 --> 00:21:23.059
You know, there's only what, what probably one 10th of 1 percent of people are actively growing a business.

00:21:23.380 --> 00:21:25.920
Enterprise that they're responsible for growing right now.

00:21:25.990 --> 00:21:27.130
It's crazy than that.

00:21:27.220 --> 00:21:28.589
The numbers are, yeah, I think you're right.

00:21:28.589 --> 00:21:35.190
One in a hundred thousand or something or one, maybe not that few, but, but one in 10, 000 or something, it's, it's low.

00:21:35.190 --> 00:21:39.119
I mean, I think the percentages, I don't know if, um, this is a hundred percent accurate, but I think it's.

00:21:39.595 --> 00:21:40.684
Uh, directionally accurate.

00:21:41.815 --> 00:21:50.724
I think the success rate of any business gets started after 10 years is almost 96, 97 percent of those businesses fail after 10 years.

00:21:51.115 --> 00:21:56.934
So to your point, like you want to get around people that can help you learn faster, you can solve problems together.

00:21:56.944 --> 00:21:59.733
More than likely might've even seen the problem that you're trying to solve.

00:21:59.733 --> 00:22:04.365
And listen, man, not, not, we don't believe all the problems are related to business development and growth.

00:22:05.744 --> 00:22:13.244
There's, There's operations, there's delivery, there's mark, you know, just headspace of the founder, owner and the team.

00:22:13.664 --> 00:22:19.914
Do you get into the marketing space much with your clients then to kind of making sure the marketing and the sales work together?

00:22:20.595 --> 00:22:21.134
We do.

00:22:21.174 --> 00:22:21.434
Yeah.

00:22:21.434 --> 00:22:22.795
We don't, we don't do marketing.

00:22:22.795 --> 00:22:29.085
We have firms that, um, that are part of our partnership group that we can, uh, introduce to those individuals.

00:22:29.085 --> 00:22:29.434
We don't.

00:22:29.644 --> 00:22:35.684
Execute marketing, but we do talk about, uh, messaging and, you know, how does that messaging line up to your ideal customer?

00:22:35.684 --> 00:22:41.075
And is that messaging, what channels are you using to try to communicate with those particular prospects?

00:22:41.714 --> 00:22:47.795
Uh, we also And even is your marketing department generating sufficient leads for your sales department to, to, uh, be successful.

00:22:48.085 --> 00:22:56.275
Yeah, that's just a foundational element that we use even in the earliest days of talking to prospective clients for Optitude.

00:22:56.934 --> 00:23:02.724
We have two different ways we get into that discussion that are related to, is your system work?

00:23:02.724 --> 00:23:04.845
Is your lead generation system working?

00:23:05.134 --> 00:23:06.555
We don't use that term.

00:23:06.894 --> 00:23:09.724
We tend to talk about, are you growth ready?

00:23:10.045 --> 00:23:15.865
So, uh, you know, if people go to our website, they're up in the right hand corner, it says, uh, ask that question.

00:23:15.865 --> 00:23:17.174
It says, are you growth ready?

00:23:17.174 --> 00:23:18.025
You're ready for growth.

00:23:18.595 --> 00:23:25.565
And what we're trying to call out is if the answer is I'm not sure, then it's a quick way it's it takes five minutes.

00:23:25.565 --> 00:23:26.795
There's 16 questions.

00:23:27.315 --> 00:23:29.875
And the questions are very much geared towards the things we're talking about.

00:23:30.305 --> 00:23:31.795
And, um, I took the test.

00:23:31.865 --> 00:23:32.875
Oh yeah.

00:23:32.875 --> 00:23:34.045
My score wasn't very high.

00:23:34.075 --> 00:23:34.765
Uh, right.

00:23:34.825 --> 00:23:43.585
Probably mostly because so much is still relies on me and remains to be built out for any other business development person to really be successful.

00:23:43.714 --> 00:23:44.244
You got it.

00:23:44.285 --> 00:23:44.634
Yeah.

00:23:44.684 --> 00:23:45.825
And that effort, I forgot you took it.

00:23:45.825 --> 00:23:46.035
Yeah.

00:23:46.315 --> 00:23:51.464
I mean, the part, the point of it is try to illuminate in your, in your mind as a founder is like.

00:23:51.464 --> 00:23:51.535
Yeah.

00:23:51.535 --> 00:23:51.555
Yeah.

00:23:51.914 --> 00:23:52.855
I don't know the answer.

00:23:52.884 --> 00:24:00.335
And then if I don't know the answer, then I probably don't have a process behind it, which isn't to isn't to, um, call out the founder.

00:24:00.335 --> 00:24:03.315
It's more to elevate the awareness.

00:24:03.325 --> 00:24:06.535
So create awareness about how am I thinking about growth?

00:24:06.914 --> 00:24:12.125
And then obviously, there's a report and that report demonstrates some of the things you'd be thinking about.

00:24:12.125 --> 00:24:19.279
And then when you're ready, as your particular growth journey as a business owner, then you can figure out, do I want to build that now?

00:24:19.279 --> 00:24:22.910
And if so, do I work with someone like Aptitude or I'd build it on my own?

00:24:22.990 --> 00:24:24.549
All those options are available to me.

00:24:24.549 --> 00:24:24.769
Yeah.

00:24:24.829 --> 00:24:25.289
Interesting.

00:24:25.799 --> 00:24:27.329
Um, excuse me.

00:24:27.369 --> 00:24:27.640
Yeah.

00:24:27.740 --> 00:24:29.490
Um, where was I going next?

00:24:29.490 --> 00:24:30.710
I had a question in mind.

00:24:31.160 --> 00:24:32.904
What would you like to tell me about, uh, it.

00:24:33.184 --> 00:24:38.565
Your clients like, Oh, I meant, I mean, I think like you can probably, we can probably align on this for sure.

00:24:38.625 --> 00:24:43.384
Um, I just got the bug for working with business owners and entrepreneurs.

00:24:43.434 --> 00:24:44.974
I think you were already starting to elude this.

00:24:45.954 --> 00:24:53.494
It's just the energy about people that start something because they care deeply about what they're trying to solve, fill in the blank business, right?

00:24:53.494 --> 00:25:02.964
They solve problems for X and then, um, how much they're willing to roll their sleeves up and, uh, and I don't want to, I don't want to say it's a sacrifice, but there's a lot of.

00:25:03.434 --> 00:25:05.904
Things that are going on behind the scenes to build a business.

00:25:05.904 --> 00:25:14.825
A lot of employees think that the owner has things really easy, you know, especially in the, not the small, but the second stage kind of environment.

00:25:15.194 --> 00:25:22.964
Oh, you know, such and such, he drives a BMW and a lot, a lot of owners don't even do that, but, but I mean, they, they're like, Oh, he's got all these employees.

00:25:22.974 --> 00:25:25.144
You must be just an easy thing to do.

00:25:25.144 --> 00:25:25.964
And it's, it's.

00:25:26.285 --> 00:25:29.414
Usually they've taken some lumps, uh, to get there.

00:25:29.515 --> 00:25:33.704
Was your wife, uh, an entrepreneur already when you met her or did she start that?

00:25:33.704 --> 00:25:37.944
She was, I mean, she's actually, you know, I've said this publicly a lot.

00:25:37.944 --> 00:25:41.194
She's the inspiration for me starting Optitude.

00:25:41.285 --> 00:25:41.724
I'm sure.

00:25:41.845 --> 00:25:42.174
Yeah.

00:25:42.184 --> 00:25:45.444
I mean, just because she, talk about mindset, right?

00:25:45.444 --> 00:25:53.869
So she had in the earliest days, um, pretty much, That one other job and then she's pretty much knew she wanted to work for herself.

00:25:53.920 --> 00:26:11.630
Yeah, and you know two decades of being an entrepreneur in today's world I would I would argue it would have been that much harder because things that we know that are making it easier like all the technology that we could sit for hours and talk about the ability for to use the internet as a way to distribute your knowledge Product.

00:26:11.710 --> 00:26:12.759
Yeah, your products or service.

00:26:13.369 --> 00:26:17.769
Um, it was just, you know, talk about brick and mortar, knocking on doors, picking up the phone.

00:26:17.769 --> 00:26:19.299
I mean, it was that type of work.

00:26:19.720 --> 00:26:27.410
Uh, so when I see people that have built businesses in those stages, not taking anything away from anyone that does it now, I'm just very inspired by those individuals.

00:26:27.420 --> 00:26:28.710
She happened to be that person.

00:26:29.410 --> 00:26:34.400
And through all the stuff that she had learned, and, and knew that she's still had challenges.

00:26:34.730 --> 00:26:37.009
You know, why wouldn't I want to help her?

00:26:37.009 --> 00:26:45.910
Number one is because she's my wife and, uh, I just feel that committed to her in, in, in not only my personal life, but in professional life.

00:26:45.970 --> 00:26:48.509
Do you guys still do stuff together in that way?

00:26:48.609 --> 00:26:48.930
Yeah.

00:26:48.930 --> 00:26:59.700
I have to say, I mean, you know, it's going to sound like card carrying, but she is a client of optitudes, her business and, uh, you know, I'm very proud of that because of all the reasons I just spoke about it is watching her business grow and, um.

00:26:59.920 --> 00:27:03.390
Talk to me about some of the different ways that clients engage with you.

00:27:03.720 --> 00:27:07.759
Is it like a boot camp, an intensive, extended stay?

00:27:07.930 --> 00:27:08.859
Yeah, exactly.

00:27:09.440 --> 00:27:15.759
Well, in the earliest days, uh, I think a lot, like a lot of consultants, we started as more of a fractional, um, you know, consultancy.

00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:19.095
And so that was me working in the earliest days with, with clients.

00:27:19.325 --> 00:27:22.474
Uh, 10 hours a week for four different companies kind of thing.

00:27:22.474 --> 00:27:22.795
Yeah.

00:27:22.795 --> 00:27:27.474
You put a shingle out there and you have framework as we talked about have framework and templates and ideas.

00:27:27.855 --> 00:27:35.055
And then once you kind of realize that that that's successful, uh, just like how we instruct companies, we had to grow it, right?

00:27:35.055 --> 00:27:44.325
So we went from one to one to one to many, and one to many for us, um, was a live, um, an academy, a live CEO.

00:27:44.339 --> 00:27:46.650
Academy, we call it the opt two Growth Academy or, okay.

00:27:46.710 --> 00:27:48.930
Um, refer to as the OGA.

00:27:49.339 --> 00:27:49.519
Okay.

00:27:49.519 --> 00:27:49.579
Yeah.

00:27:49.579 --> 00:27:50.390
To keep it short.

00:27:50.450 --> 00:27:59.390
And, uh, we, we did that, uh, a little over two, little over two years ago and did it with a number of founders, as we all know, live and virtual.

00:27:59.390 --> 00:28:02.710
So it was live as it was, uh, scheduled time, but it was over.

00:28:03.339 --> 00:28:03.789
Zoom.

00:28:03.910 --> 00:28:04.299
Okay.

00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:04.420
Yeah.

00:28:04.420 --> 00:28:06.250
And we had clients from all around the country.

00:28:06.250 --> 00:28:15.269
We actually had our first international client, so the time zones were very odd, but that individual was up, uh, early, early the morning.

00:28:15.275 --> 00:28:22.109
So yeah, and, and, and, and went through the program and, uh, we were excited about their ability to grow their business as a consultancy.

00:28:22.970 --> 00:28:24.380
Uh, they're in the risk management.

00:28:24.380 --> 00:28:25.940
Is that your primary offering now then?

00:28:25.940 --> 00:28:28.250
Is the one to many or you do both still?

00:28:28.309 --> 00:28:29.240
We do both.

00:28:29.240 --> 00:28:31.309
And then we can refer to the kind of the.

00:28:31.845 --> 00:28:36.525
The, uh, time and materials are the fractional role, very much VIP.

00:28:36.585 --> 00:28:47.055
And what I mean by that is that there, there's a high bar for someone to get into that group if they are interested in that type of very hands-on, um, bespoke type of work.

00:28:47.085 --> 00:28:47.265
Yep.

00:28:47.654 --> 00:28:50.654
For all the obvious reasons, it takes more resources for us to deliver.

00:28:50.654 --> 00:28:50.984
Sure.

00:28:50.984 --> 00:28:54.755
On the other hand, um, that is not our, that is not our major.

00:28:55.275 --> 00:29:03.134
Uh, focus, as far as delivery, our major focuses really are either live and virtual, which is one time a year or our on demand program.

00:29:03.134 --> 00:29:13.335
So we've taken the entire academy and you can, uh, sign up for it a couple of times a year when we promote it and then join the academy, get all the same materials, all the same training.

00:29:13.335 --> 00:29:17.315
It's just, um, you go through a self serve style instead of.

00:29:18.089 --> 00:29:18.970
Be there together.

00:29:19.019 --> 00:29:19.470
Bingo.

00:29:19.579 --> 00:29:19.859
Yeah.

00:29:19.859 --> 00:29:20.589
We still have a community.

00:29:20.589 --> 00:29:21.269
It's just online.

00:29:21.269 --> 00:29:24.049
So people communicate, um, through a platform.

00:29:24.069 --> 00:29:29.329
It's called the up to a growth community and people can kind of, um, use their technology.

00:29:29.329 --> 00:29:30.609
Man, that sounds like a push.

00:29:30.839 --> 00:29:44.480
Uh, how was it to, I mean, maybe not, maybe it's mostly just kind of digitizing and systematizing the things that you'd already been doing, even starting back in your fractional days with your wife and stuff, it still sounds like a push.

00:29:44.500 --> 00:29:45.029
It was.

00:29:45.380 --> 00:29:45.730
Create.

00:29:47.295 --> 00:29:52.295
And, you know, there was kind of the big rage, you're kind of behind the rage, uh, a little bit.

00:29:52.605 --> 00:29:58.515
Yeah, I mean, I think, uh, COVID, creating coaches, courses and stuff was kind of going before COVID and then it hit high.

00:29:59.134 --> 00:29:59.365
Yeah.

00:29:59.365 --> 00:30:03.855
We're catching it a little bit on the down, down curve, which might be good because.

00:30:04.684 --> 00:30:09.684
Like there was so many for a while, I was like, every person you knew was creating a course a hundred percent.

00:30:09.684 --> 00:30:21.424
Yeah, it, it definitely, I think you hit, hit it right at the top of, uh, when COVID was super popular, you know, everyone knows what happened and everyone was in their own environment, trying to figure out how to, Be creative and learn.

00:30:21.424 --> 00:30:23.214
And it just exploded.

00:30:23.744 --> 00:30:28.275
Um, we were in the beginning phases of building that, that program.

00:30:28.525 --> 00:30:31.984
Uh, it just is, as you said, it just takes time, time and resources.

00:30:32.525 --> 00:30:34.555
I'm lucky enough to have a small team around me.

00:30:34.555 --> 00:30:38.795
So we have someone that, uh, on the team that's an expert, uh, in that particular area.

00:30:38.795 --> 00:30:49.085
So as we got going with building it, um, we had a creative, you know, what story, story lining and all the video capture and editing and yeah, it's a lot.

00:30:49.085 --> 00:30:49.434
I think.

00:30:49.650 --> 00:31:01.500
I mean, I think you, and I talked about this off camera a bit is it looks real easy when you're on the other end, watching somebody's course and going through it, and then you create one and build it.

00:31:01.569 --> 00:31:09.130
And you're, I mean, it's like back in the day, um, there's little mechanical cars, you get the hobby shop and you see someone around the street playing with it.

00:31:09.130 --> 00:31:15.869
This is dating me a bit as like a, uh, uh, radio frequency car, and then you'd go to the hobby shop and get all this stuff to build it.

00:31:15.869 --> 00:31:17.505
And you're like, Where do I start?

00:31:18.664 --> 00:31:19.855
Bunch of parts and pieces.

00:31:19.934 --> 00:31:25.744
Um, but we did it, you know, we, we stayed focused and we're, you know, we were able to get, uh, get it launched last year.

00:31:25.744 --> 00:31:27.775
So, uh, we're excited about that offering.

00:31:27.775 --> 00:31:32.285
So we do again, VIP, we have a, uh, a live virtual academy that's once a year.

00:31:32.315 --> 00:31:35.144
And then we have the on demand program that's, uh, twice a year.

00:31:35.154 --> 00:31:36.674
And that virtual academy, is that like a.

00:31:37.134 --> 00:31:39.025
10 week kind of thing or something.

00:31:39.025 --> 00:31:40.775
It's not just a one day.

00:31:40.815 --> 00:31:42.954
But no, good, good, good question.

00:31:42.994 --> 00:31:45.335
Um, we've tried to shorten it to 12 weeks.

00:31:45.335 --> 00:31:46.914
So a quarter, right?

00:31:47.234 --> 00:31:54.295
We, we, we want, um, the founders and CEOs that join it to understand that they have to be very committed to that amount of time.

00:31:54.295 --> 00:32:00.815
It's not more than 90 to 120 minutes a week, depending on what module they're in going through the training.

00:32:00.815 --> 00:32:03.394
So you say, all right, I'm going to schedule that time out.

00:32:03.775 --> 00:32:06.255
Most founders are working probably 60 hours a week.

00:32:06.954 --> 00:32:12.865
It's not a ton of time and we're talking low percentages, but you've got to be really like, this is a problem you want to solve as a founder.

00:32:12.865 --> 00:32:17.744
So then we think you can get great momentum and starting to solve it within 12 weeks.

00:32:18.305 --> 00:32:21.815
Uh, so that, that's how we like to, uh, to think about the program.

00:32:21.875 --> 00:32:28.654
Is that your growth model potentially is like to offer that more frequently or something, or do you like the cadence that you have or?

00:32:28.704 --> 00:32:29.535
We like the cadence.

00:32:29.575 --> 00:32:33.234
Um, we obviously trying to build a community around it.

00:32:33.275 --> 00:32:36.595
And so what I mean by that is that we really think we can get.

00:32:37.210 --> 00:32:41.109
more and more of the people that to stick around through that sort of building.

00:32:41.420 --> 00:32:44.660
And why I say that, and I'd be curious, but you, you experienced it with them.

00:32:44.660 --> 00:32:45.250
I'm curious.

00:32:45.250 --> 00:32:45.500
Yeah.

00:32:45.539 --> 00:32:49.400
Um, we don't think this is a problem you solve fully in 12 weeks.

00:32:49.410 --> 00:32:49.910
Right.

00:32:50.059 --> 00:32:53.440
As you heard me kind of allude, we think you can begin to solve.

00:32:53.440 --> 00:33:02.529
Well, and markets change, customer expectations change, you know, and it can be a way of thinking more than, uh, what to do.

00:33:02.720 --> 00:33:03.440
You got it.

00:33:03.630 --> 00:33:05.339
Uh, it's probably not a mark.

00:33:05.359 --> 00:33:05.569
Yeah.

00:33:05.569 --> 00:33:10.765
Market change is huge, but, um, Just because you build it once doesn't make you a mastering.

00:33:11.265 --> 00:33:11.694
Yeah, yeah.

00:33:11.994 --> 00:33:18.224
So we kind of think of it as you start as a beginner, you may come in as like, Hey, I have enough background on this, but we haven't fully built it out.

00:33:18.625 --> 00:33:21.045
So you go from like, you know, beginner to intermediate.

00:33:21.085 --> 00:33:26.154
And then, you know, you, you hit that expert level, but we're looking for people to become masters of it.

00:33:26.625 --> 00:33:29.539
So we think, uh, an average amount of time.

00:33:29.549 --> 00:33:31.349
People would stay in our community about three years.

00:33:31.390 --> 00:33:31.710
Okay.

00:33:31.710 --> 00:33:31.960
Yeah.

00:33:31.990 --> 00:33:33.670
So we want that to be the hub.

00:33:33.880 --> 00:33:39.640
Uh, we obviously, as we Or even longer with, you know, regular feeders of fresh meat, that kind of thing.

00:33:39.650 --> 00:33:39.960
Yeah.

00:33:40.529 --> 00:33:44.480
We were just talking about the, the explosion of EOS.

00:33:44.539 --> 00:33:45.119
Oh, sure.

00:33:45.200 --> 00:33:46.119
You know, and, and.

00:33:47.765 --> 00:33:58.815
I don't know, maybe it's been more popular in the Denver region for longer, but at least up here, you know, Ken Schrader was the only EOS guy in town for a while and now there's five or six or something like that.

00:33:58.835 --> 00:34:07.154
And, um, and a lot more companies, I think 40 percent of my next level members are at some level of implementation or have implemented.

00:34:07.924 --> 00:34:12.335
Is that complimentary to your, what your team does in the revenue side?

00:34:12.344 --> 00:34:17.204
That's one of the problems that EOS uncovers is, Hey, your revenues aren't scalable.

00:34:17.635 --> 00:34:19.764
Uh, and are you friends with that community or how's it?

00:34:19.894 --> 00:34:20.565
Oh, totally.

00:34:20.965 --> 00:34:21.795
We're big fans of the U.

00:34:21.795 --> 00:34:21.934
S.

00:34:22.494 --> 00:34:26.914
So straight out of the gates, number one, I'm at Gina Wickman and what he and his group have built.

00:34:27.014 --> 00:34:31.405
Um, uh, I think Kelly Knight might still be the president there.

00:34:31.434 --> 00:34:33.599
Um, but anyways, long, long story.

00:34:33.820 --> 00:34:37.210
story short on that is, yeah, we think the framework makes sense.

00:34:37.710 --> 00:34:44.219
Uh, we understand the framework, we're very knowledgeable at it with an aptitude, uh, but I think it is complimentary.

00:34:44.219 --> 00:34:50.440
And why I say that as we've talked and worked with a number of implementers, um, throughout the six plus years, we've been in business.

00:34:51.190 --> 00:35:02.710
And what we, we hear is that, uh, that problem that you and I are referring to is growth building and billing predictability relative to sales and revenue is not a, just, it's not a cornerstone of the framework.

00:35:02.710 --> 00:35:02.824
Okay.

00:35:02.824 --> 00:35:10.159
It's in it, but it's not the, if you strip it back a bit, it's not there as part of what they do.

00:35:10.159 --> 00:35:12.385
So we, we really come alongside as one.

00:35:12.394 --> 00:35:13.494
They'll say you got to fix that.

00:35:13.585 --> 00:35:14.135
Yeah.

00:35:14.304 --> 00:35:15.815
But not as much about how to fix it.

00:35:15.855 --> 00:35:16.304
Bingo.

00:35:16.465 --> 00:35:19.385
And we think we can be extremely, continue to be extremely complimentary.

00:35:19.835 --> 00:35:28.179
We love businesses that are running on EOS because, um, We think that that framework is not too difficult to understand.

00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:30.519
The tools and templates are amazing.

00:35:30.550 --> 00:35:33.210
Um, I think in the last 18 months, you might know better.

00:35:33.639 --> 00:35:37.469
They now have, um, a lot of those tools and templates online on a platform.

00:35:37.900 --> 00:35:41.960
And, uh, so I just think that, uh, having business owners.

00:35:42.675 --> 00:35:44.525
Have an ability to see that framework.

00:35:44.525 --> 00:35:48.885
It really conceptualizes where they're at and what they need to do to get to the next level.

00:35:49.335 --> 00:35:58.135
Well, I think what you were intimating is that we can build a community around Optitude's brand and framework, you know, God bless you.

00:35:58.135 --> 00:36:11.875
If you, maybe you won't get quite as big as EOS, but if you can build kind of a, uh, aptitude alumnus association and, you know, have a lot of companies doing things the aptitude way or whatever that is, right.

00:36:12.324 --> 00:36:14.929
Um, You know, I think that's an opportunity there for sure.

00:36:15.130 --> 00:36:16.579
Yeah, I appreciate the idea.

00:36:17.280 --> 00:36:18.300
It is on our roadmap.

00:36:18.489 --> 00:36:21.219
I don't think we have a vision to be as big as EOS.

00:36:21.219 --> 00:36:22.300
No, I wouldn't imagine.

00:36:22.960 --> 00:36:24.380
They have some outside funding.

00:36:24.679 --> 00:36:27.699
I think they got private equity back maybe a handful of years ago.

00:36:27.699 --> 00:36:28.250
Yeah, yeah.

00:36:28.309 --> 00:36:35.710
I think, I don't know the numbers, so I don't want to speak, but I think it's like thousands, hundreds of thousands of implementers across the I wouldn't doubt it.

00:36:35.710 --> 00:36:36.599
Yeah, United States.

00:36:36.619 --> 00:36:37.519
Hundreds of thousands?

00:36:37.784 --> 00:36:42.905
I want to say, I mean, I heard there's like 30 to 40 just in, just in Colorado.

00:36:43.434 --> 00:36:45.135
Uh, but listen, we're, we're big fans.

00:36:45.135 --> 00:36:47.164
10, 000 anyway, around the country.

00:36:47.184 --> 00:36:57.625
Yeah, we, we probably see it a bit more about, um, our goal is, you know, to try to get to, uh, between a thousand and maybe 2, 500 raving fans.

00:36:57.945 --> 00:36:58.275
Okay.

00:36:58.315 --> 00:37:05.425
And what I mean by raving fans is, you heard me allude to the fact that Uh, we want people to, to be here and to stick around.

00:37:05.554 --> 00:37:11.914
And one of the precursors is they have to just be a learner by the, the, the customers we work with.

00:37:12.364 --> 00:37:18.164
Uh, they need to be a learner just by their DNA disposition, growth minded, um, growth oriented.

00:37:18.369 --> 00:37:24.679
Uh, open to learning, know that they don't know everything, want to love to learn from others, like be a part of a community.

00:37:24.820 --> 00:37:25.000
Yeah.

00:37:25.190 --> 00:37:31.349
Uh, we find people that we work with, uh, not only are, have EOS implementation, but they've likely been a part of EO.

00:37:31.860 --> 00:37:33.780
Um, they've been a part of Vistage.

00:37:33.780 --> 00:37:34.510
Yeah, Vistage.

00:37:34.510 --> 00:37:35.530
Or local think tank or something.

00:37:35.570 --> 00:37:39.320
Yeah, I mean, I think in the same way you're, I mean, I think that's really a cool model you've built.

00:37:39.320 --> 00:37:47.739
I mean, you've, I think that same competition is uniquely positioned how you built local think tank is like, Hey, we want to be local.

00:37:47.849 --> 00:37:58.050
And I think the community aspect is huge because there's relatability that we're trying to all grow in a literally a zip code or two away from each other.

00:37:58.059 --> 00:37:58.449
Yeah.

00:37:58.449 --> 00:37:58.809
Yeah.

00:37:58.869 --> 00:38:01.309
And I think you can build connections like that today.

00:38:01.309 --> 00:38:03.429
I think it's, it's a starving need.

00:38:06.054 --> 00:38:16.985
I've definitely had, um, a few members join that, that said, you know, I've been called on by this organization and that organization and just none of them really felt right.

00:38:17.505 --> 00:38:23.094
But after I got your voice message, you know, I went and looked up your website for like an hour and I think I want to learn more, you know?

00:38:23.585 --> 00:38:29.264
And so I think there is, and I think it's an increasing phenomenon, uh, in the world today.

00:38:29.264 --> 00:38:33.195
I, uh, sensations around, we're trying to think about what are.

00:38:33.784 --> 00:38:39.494
Significant differentiator is a little bit and kind of our local ness.

00:38:40.210 --> 00:38:49.730
You know, and even though we want to build a national brand, we want to be local to wherever we're at and have that kind of a, a culture and how do we express that?

00:38:49.730 --> 00:38:50.739
How do we communicate that?

00:38:50.820 --> 00:38:52.679
Does it actually matter to enough people?

00:38:52.750 --> 00:38:53.139
Yeah.

00:38:53.469 --> 00:39:02.059
I mean, I, I don't, I haven't had a chance to meet a number of your business owners, but from what you and I've talked about on and off for the last year, I do think.

00:39:02.315 --> 00:39:26.275
It's even in your branded name that if you could flush that out, uh, I do think locale relationships, the local wait watchers could be, I don't know what your programming is inside of a local think tank to add some stuff, but yeah, yeah, but in a lot of ways, um, I feel like people, their connection is going to be greater than just, um, the business, right?

00:39:26.275 --> 00:39:33.195
Because they like locally share, you know, jokingly, the gym, they go, Hey, we go to the same gym or we go to the same, our kids are in soccer together.

00:39:33.215 --> 00:39:33.585
Yeah.

00:39:33.585 --> 00:39:35.864
We're at school or we go to the same church and.

00:39:36.469 --> 00:39:41.590
I, I do think that plays out maybe in other national, um, groups that bring business owners together.

00:39:42.199 --> 00:39:46.840
But I still think there's a depth to, um, the, the headquarters is here.

00:39:47.380 --> 00:39:56.809
And so, you know, I mean, so you, you've started in Northern Colorado, if I'm not mistaken, and as you continue to expand, I don't want to say there, um, you can kind of think of the model.

00:39:56.809 --> 00:40:00.030
There's also a lot of businesses that aren't in big cities.

00:40:00.860 --> 00:40:09.690
So what I mean by that is that what I love about that's well and I think nobody really cares about local community that much if they're in a town of more than 400, 000.

00:40:11.005 --> 00:40:17.925
Yeah, I mean, I don't know enough about the franchising world, but I don't know if you remember much about the business of Subway sandwiches.

00:40:17.985 --> 00:40:18.425
Yeah, yeah.

00:40:18.485 --> 00:40:23.445
Their, their original strategy, if I'm not mistaken, is, uh, way back.

00:40:23.844 --> 00:40:24.045
Yeah.

00:40:24.045 --> 00:40:25.585
Which they went to rural towns.

00:40:25.585 --> 00:40:26.034
Totally.

00:40:26.144 --> 00:40:27.244
And they popped up.

00:40:27.519 --> 00:40:38.360
Um, franchises and then built from there and it, I'm from North Dakota and like when subway came, everyone was talking about, cause they faced, like there was a Hardee's that had been there for 20 years and that was pretty much the taco Johns.

00:40:38.369 --> 00:40:38.650
Yeah.

00:40:38.860 --> 00:40:39.039
Yeah.

00:40:39.159 --> 00:40:39.460
Yeah.

00:40:39.530 --> 00:40:44.920
And I think, I feel like that kind of vibe, you know, you and your team and your, and your other leaders could, could dig into it.

00:40:45.420 --> 00:40:49.389
I feel like that's a strategy because think about what's happening right now with technology.

00:40:49.909 --> 00:40:51.250
The world's getting so small.

00:40:51.260 --> 00:40:51.280
Yeah.

00:40:52.460 --> 00:40:56.070
There are people in places all over, is this usually the United States?

00:40:56.070 --> 00:40:57.539
This is as a starting point.

00:40:57.599 --> 00:40:58.010
Yeah, yeah.

00:40:58.059 --> 00:41:00.619
Most of the people in the United States do not live in a big city.

00:41:01.210 --> 00:41:01.659
Right.

00:41:02.139 --> 00:41:11.244
So therefore, if you then are thinking, I want to start a business, and I need to build and be a part of a community, why go with those big groups when I could go with, Yeah.

00:41:11.255 --> 00:41:13.025
Local think tank of Minnesota.

00:41:13.054 --> 00:41:15.414
Local think tank of small rural town Minnesota.

00:41:15.414 --> 00:41:15.905
Right, right.

00:41:16.105 --> 00:41:17.164
Because there's going to be a proliferation.

00:41:17.164 --> 00:41:22.364
Well, every region will have its own kind of flag of sorts, own page probably on a website or something.

00:41:22.425 --> 00:41:22.844
Yeah.

00:41:22.905 --> 00:41:24.565
I mean, we could, we could map it out right now.

00:41:25.364 --> 00:41:26.855
Well, we'll probably run out of time.

00:41:26.885 --> 00:41:27.335
Yeah.

00:41:27.494 --> 00:41:30.664
But I, but I think it's, I think it's the right thing for us.

00:41:30.675 --> 00:41:31.784
That's what feels right.

00:41:31.824 --> 00:41:31.974
Yeah.

00:41:31.974 --> 00:41:34.545
You know, we still got to develop a lot of strategy around that, but.

00:41:34.574 --> 00:41:34.844
Sure.

00:41:35.125 --> 00:41:43.170
That, because there's middle market companies, you know, Northern Colorado is what, what Half million people, maybe 800, 000, probably between Weld and Larimer.

00:41:43.230 --> 00:41:43.500
Yeah.

00:41:44.739 --> 00:41:53.260
But, but only, you know, Port Collins, 170, Greeley is 120 years or something, you know, there's only all those cities are much smaller than that full region.

00:41:53.599 --> 00:41:57.429
I think about, um, just know, how long, how long have you been doing this then?

00:41:57.440 --> 00:41:58.280
Uh, 10 years?

00:41:58.469 --> 00:41:58.679
Yeah.

00:41:58.679 --> 00:42:04.360
So you think about 10 years, um, and now you have, you know, not only the framework, we started really, really small.

00:42:04.360 --> 00:42:04.619
Yeah.

00:42:05.199 --> 00:42:05.869
I think it's just, it's exciting.

00:42:06.179 --> 00:42:21.619
I feel like there's something there and, um, I, I am hopeful that we, we also may support some of that same sort of thinking where, you know, if you're fully funded from an outside company and you're trying to grow your business, you're likely not a good fit for Optitude.

00:42:21.969 --> 00:42:29.650
We're looking for people that literally rolled up their sleeves, found a way to bring some capital together, wanted to start a business because they wanted to solve a problem for.

00:42:30.079 --> 00:42:31.750
A client, a customer, a prospect.

00:42:32.369 --> 00:42:47.340
And we, uh, with that too, we're excited about, we just relate to what I would call like in, uh, why I grew up in Western Pennsylvania, we call it the blue collar hustle, which is just roll your sleeves up, get up, go figure out how to make, make it work and learn as you go.

00:42:47.639 --> 00:42:51.940
How do you think, uh, Pennsylvania is going to go in the, uh, It's getting a lot of attention.

00:42:51.940 --> 00:42:53.360
Geez, I don't know.

00:42:53.360 --> 00:42:55.059
I mean, I haven't been there since my earliest days.

00:42:55.059 --> 00:42:56.269
It's hard to say.

00:42:56.449 --> 00:43:01.760
Yeah, hard to say, because literally the western and the eastern part of the, uh, of the state.

00:43:01.900 --> 00:43:02.699
I imagine.

00:43:03.039 --> 00:43:06.719
Are very kind of concentrated, and the middle is the sandwich.

00:43:06.730 --> 00:43:06.760
Right.

00:43:06.760 --> 00:43:08.860
And it's, um, So I'm not sure.

00:43:08.869 --> 00:43:10.139
And it's evolved over the years.

00:43:10.139 --> 00:43:12.679
And I don't know how much your listeners know about Western PA.

00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:16.489
Um, in Pittsburgh, it was a steel, steel town, steel city.

00:43:16.519 --> 00:43:18.360
It is nothing like that anymore.

00:43:18.360 --> 00:43:19.440
It's high tech.

00:43:19.460 --> 00:43:19.880
Yeah.

00:43:19.929 --> 00:43:22.530
It's, it's, uh, it's some kind of a sexy place to live.

00:43:22.570 --> 00:43:22.780
Yeah.

00:43:22.780 --> 00:43:23.469
Insurance.

00:43:23.500 --> 00:43:27.159
Uh, as far as health, health care, it's like top healthcare in the, in the, in the world.

00:43:27.219 --> 00:43:31.405
Um, yeah, I mean, it's, um, it's, I think the number one, uh, that's where you're from is Pittsburgh.

00:43:31.664 --> 00:43:31.974
Pittsburgh.

00:43:31.994 --> 00:43:34.045
I grew up in Pittsburgh, South Hills.

00:43:34.105 --> 00:43:40.275
And so, so I don't know, I can't say I'm not a political proxy or what, I guess, uh, Prognosticator.

00:43:40.275 --> 00:43:41.025
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:43:41.244 --> 00:43:42.235
I have no idea.

00:43:42.244 --> 00:43:44.565
Honestly, I try to stay out of the political environment.

00:43:44.625 --> 00:43:46.065
I say that lighthearted.

00:43:46.065 --> 00:43:46.545
I mean, I care.

00:43:46.545 --> 00:43:47.184
I'm an American.

00:43:47.184 --> 00:43:50.364
I care about what politically our system is, how it's run.

00:43:50.905 --> 00:43:58.494
However, uh, on a, on a different scale, I, I joke a lot with some of our business owners that you, I'll hear that, Oh, you know, the times are rough.

00:43:58.494 --> 00:44:01.974
Or so my business is going to fluctuate because of who's in office.

00:44:01.974 --> 00:44:04.164
And the data doesn't support that.

00:44:04.235 --> 00:44:04.914
The data is.

00:44:05.449 --> 00:44:05.730
Yeah.

00:44:05.769 --> 00:44:14.010
It doesn't matter who's in office, at least in this country, uh, for the most part, it's really about staying focused, going after what you're going after as a business owner.

00:44:14.010 --> 00:44:15.119
So agreed.

00:44:15.130 --> 00:44:15.840
We'll see what happens.

00:44:16.139 --> 00:44:17.610
Um, yes, it's true.

00:44:17.690 --> 00:44:19.900
Just, uh, that's like three weeks away from today.

00:44:20.829 --> 00:44:22.739
I'm kind of tired of the political ads, honestly.

00:44:23.590 --> 00:44:25.480
Well be glad you're not in Pennsylvania.

00:44:25.909 --> 00:44:32.960
Those poor bastards are getting dominated by Elon's given a million dollars a day away to.

00:44:33.114 --> 00:44:34.614
registered voter thing.

00:44:34.625 --> 00:44:35.264
Did you read about that?

00:44:35.275 --> 00:44:36.125
I did not.

00:44:36.155 --> 00:44:37.914
Oh, it sounds terrible.

00:44:37.985 --> 00:44:48.155
Well, it's a So, if you sign the petition, the first, supporting the first and second amendments, Um, right to free speech, right to bear arms, Yeah.

00:44:48.554 --> 00:44:56.585
and you're a registered voter, uh, then you're qualified for, uh, one million dollars a day being given away for the last ten days.

00:44:56.664 --> 00:44:57.414
Oh my gosh, dude.

00:44:57.425 --> 00:45:11.434
And there's a bunch of people that are like, this is illegal, you can't have a sweepstakes, da da da da, and then there's a bunch of other people that are like, duh, there's no, uh, he's not, uh, You don't have to pay to enter, you just have to register to vote, uh, and sign this petition.

00:45:11.434 --> 00:45:13.324
So it's not a gambling thing.

00:45:13.925 --> 00:45:16.315
There's this huge, I've become a Twitter fan.

00:45:16.385 --> 00:45:16.804
Okay.

00:45:16.894 --> 00:45:22.375
Uh, and so like Mark Cuban has a huge boner for Elon Musk right now.

00:45:22.605 --> 00:45:23.114
Interesting.

00:45:23.565 --> 00:45:25.434
He's like all critical.

00:45:25.434 --> 00:45:27.315
And anyway, I digress.

00:45:27.335 --> 00:45:27.835
It's funny.

00:45:27.835 --> 00:45:29.594
Not that you need to know this, but Mark Cuban went.

00:45:29.905 --> 00:45:31.465
It's, uh, the same ice car I went to.

00:45:31.525 --> 00:45:31.914
Oh, is that right?

00:45:31.914 --> 00:45:32.875
So he's from Western Pennsylvania.

00:45:32.875 --> 00:45:34.255
Was he kind of a dweeb back then too?

00:45:34.465 --> 00:45:34.914
I don't know.

00:45:34.914 --> 00:45:35.815
I didn't know him personally.

00:45:35.815 --> 00:45:36.864
I knew some people that knew him.

00:45:36.925 --> 00:45:38.815
Um, I actually have a lot of respect for him.

00:45:38.815 --> 00:45:41.005
His insurance ideas are really interesting.

00:45:41.094 --> 00:45:41.364
Yeah.

00:45:41.364 --> 00:45:41.635
Yeah.

00:45:41.635 --> 00:45:42.204
Ever looked into that.

00:45:42.204 --> 00:45:42.264
Yeah.

00:45:42.264 --> 00:45:46.315
And some of the stuff he's doing with, um, uh, pharmaceuticals and bringing, right, right.

00:45:46.375 --> 00:45:46.614
Yeah.

00:45:46.914 --> 00:45:47.664
Yeah, yeah.

00:45:47.664 --> 00:45:47.726
I met.

00:45:48.114 --> 00:45:48.735
I will say this.

00:45:48.735 --> 00:45:51.324
I mean, you know, he's, he's a, he's a, he's an entrepreneur again.

00:45:51.324 --> 00:45:52.565
Before it was, it was cool.

00:45:52.875 --> 00:45:56.644
He started one of the first, um, I think it was cable companies, uh, Western PA.

00:45:57.295 --> 00:46:01.704
And, um, yeah, so I mean, that's probably why you're going to say it was your weed dealer.

00:46:01.755 --> 00:46:06.295
No, no, no, I don't think Mark, I don't know what Mark was into those days.

00:46:06.905 --> 00:46:10.175
Uh, he's a couple of years older than a handful of years older than me, but, um.

00:46:10.445 --> 00:46:14.074
I'm sure that's why, uh, Elon's hanging out with him because he's pretty connected back there.

00:46:14.355 --> 00:46:14.925
Probably.

00:46:15.434 --> 00:46:18.394
Um, so what else do you want people to know about Optitude?

00:46:18.425 --> 00:46:20.264
Or should we, uh, jump in the time machine?

00:46:20.574 --> 00:46:21.335
Oh, I don't know.

00:46:21.335 --> 00:46:28.284
I mean, um, listen, I mean, we're, we're just a, uh, a company that A boutique firm helping your sales work good.

00:46:28.344 --> 00:46:28.965
That's it, man.

00:46:28.965 --> 00:46:34.219
We're a boutique firm focusing on, um, You know, professional service firms, uh, across the country.

00:46:35.039 --> 00:46:39.409
Uh, we obviously are big fans of all the businesses and most of our early days.

00:46:39.409 --> 00:46:41.849
And, and still now is, is Colorado based companies.

00:46:42.309 --> 00:46:46.940
So we're a big fan of, of Colorado based companies and we'd love to, you know, connect and reach out.

00:46:46.940 --> 00:46:50.769
Like I said before, the best thing is to get people knowledge about what we do.

00:46:50.860 --> 00:46:52.730
And, uh, we do have a number of free.

00:46:53.715 --> 00:46:56.344
Do take the, uh, growth readiness test.

00:46:56.344 --> 00:46:57.385
It's insightful.

00:46:57.394 --> 00:47:04.445
Like, uh, just going through it, it's like, I don't, I don't like the answer of this question, but I have to be truthful.

00:47:04.514 --> 00:47:06.244
Uh, I appreciate the shout out a minute.

00:47:06.295 --> 00:47:07.715
We, that's why we build it, right?

00:47:07.934 --> 00:47:11.744
Just like any other, first of all, you don't have a lot of time, so it's probably five minutes, right?

00:47:11.744 --> 00:47:12.405
Yeah, for sure.

00:47:12.635 --> 00:47:14.525
You get a report that starts to give you an idea.

00:47:14.525 --> 00:47:14.695
Like, come on.

00:47:15.614 --> 00:47:17.414
I don't know if I'm thinking about this right way.

00:47:17.715 --> 00:47:24.664
And as you and I've talked off, off camera and off Mike, you have plans to continue to grow, but you'll do it when you're ready.

00:47:24.664 --> 00:47:31.335
But now you have some general ideas to be thinking about, could I solve maybe one or two of these problems now that makes minor improvements.

00:47:31.755 --> 00:47:33.885
So yeah, check us out at optitude.

00:47:34.184 --> 00:47:34.485
co.

00:47:34.635 --> 00:47:39.704
And then, uh, if you don't, if we're connected on LinkedIn, if you people want to connect LinkedIn, that's the best way.

00:47:39.985 --> 00:47:41.494
Just like it sounds Brian Kurlan.

00:47:41.625 --> 00:47:42.425
Yeah, exactly.

00:47:42.454 --> 00:47:43.954
Um, I did.

00:47:44.005 --> 00:47:53.784
Oh, I was going to reflect the first, uh, the first piece of semi intellectual property that local think tank created or me, um, was our floats test.

00:47:54.034 --> 00:47:54.514
Interesting.

00:47:54.534 --> 00:47:55.614
Tell me more about it.

00:47:55.614 --> 00:47:57.204
Basically a self assessment.

00:47:57.235 --> 00:47:57.644
Okay.

00:47:57.804 --> 00:48:07.840
Uh, how do you rate yourself on a scale of one to five stars in financial leadership, uh, opportunities versus obsolescence?

00:48:08.480 --> 00:48:13.530
Administrative technology and risk management and sales and marketing.

00:48:13.880 --> 00:48:14.480
Fascinating.

00:48:14.690 --> 00:48:16.969
And uh, so then your kind of composite score.

00:48:16.969 --> 00:48:19.130
My initial composite score was 13.

00:48:19.280 --> 00:48:19.639
Okay.

00:48:19.820 --> 00:48:23.280
Out of a potential, whatever, five times six 30.

00:48:23.460 --> 00:48:23.760
Okay.

00:48:24.690 --> 00:48:27.659
which I think 13 might have been my score on your growth readiness test.

00:48:28.079 --> 00:48:29.340
Could be, could be a lucky 13 though, for you.

00:48:29.340 --> 00:48:29.639
He could say.

00:48:29.639 --> 00:48:30.000
Maybe.

00:48:30.005 --> 00:48:30.869
Maybe, yeah.

00:48:30.920 --> 00:48:39.449
But I think the, the thing that's interesting is that that's one of the first things that both of us kind of worked on for our business is creating kind of an assessment.

00:48:39.679 --> 00:48:40.150
Yeah.

00:48:40.219 --> 00:48:40.840
I'm a believer.

00:48:40.869 --> 00:48:41.510
Where are you at?

00:48:41.550 --> 00:48:42.619
Why did you, why did you do it?

00:48:42.619 --> 00:48:44.309
I know why we, we thought about it.

00:48:44.320 --> 00:48:45.610
Well, I just wanted to float.

00:48:46.074 --> 00:48:50.135
You know, and at that time, um, you know, that was my place in life.

00:48:50.135 --> 00:48:51.864
And then we've changed it to thrives.

00:48:52.065 --> 00:48:52.425
Okay.

00:48:52.434 --> 00:48:55.815
Since then I forced a different, less useful acronym on it.

00:48:55.815 --> 00:49:00.425
And now nobody knows how to answer the questions, but I wanted to move from floating to thriving.

00:49:00.565 --> 00:49:00.965
Yeah.

00:49:01.135 --> 00:49:08.635
So I got to put my thinking hat on and come up with a better acronym that, but, but, you know, maybe it's maybe floats is what we use with the little guys.

00:49:08.635 --> 00:49:09.505
Cause they just want to get there.

00:49:09.804 --> 00:49:12.385
So they float, you know, and don't have to kick so hard all the time.

00:49:12.394 --> 00:49:13.385
Yeah, it's exhausting.

00:49:13.394 --> 00:49:17.474
And our second stage can, you know, do some Thrive stuff or whatever.

00:49:17.474 --> 00:49:17.965
Yeah.

00:49:18.315 --> 00:49:18.534
Yeah.

00:49:18.534 --> 00:49:29.465
I do think, you know, that's obviously branding and marketing messaging and stuff, but I just like the thinking around, um, don't go, don't spend your time, money and resources.

00:49:29.934 --> 00:49:37.934
either in the work we do or maybe if you feel this way about loco, until you have a sense of what is my baseline, right?

00:49:37.934 --> 00:49:38.954
So that's what the growth readiness.

00:49:38.954 --> 00:49:39.574
Circumstance.

00:49:39.605 --> 00:49:39.885
Yeah.

00:49:39.885 --> 00:49:40.375
Circumstance.

00:49:40.375 --> 00:49:45.235
Cause context and foundation are the, what we believe is even the first part of the work we do.

00:49:45.244 --> 00:49:52.260
Once somebody gets their diagnosis, as in collaboratively, we say, What is the context and foundation of what you're doing?

00:49:52.809 --> 00:49:58.519
Because if you don't have a starting point that has reference, everything is not a priority.

00:49:58.699 --> 00:50:00.829
Everything is not uniquely important to you.

00:50:01.090 --> 00:50:01.659
You know what I mean?

00:50:01.659 --> 00:50:09.699
And so I think that's a major flaw in some of the consulting that's out there in the world is like, Hey, I sell, um, blue paint.

00:50:09.829 --> 00:50:12.460
And because I sell blue paint, then I see everything.

00:50:12.469 --> 00:50:14.519
And it's, it's, we're all inherently have bias.

00:50:15.230 --> 00:50:23.534
And so what we're trying to do is remove that bias and give, um, Us a chance to learn about the situation that we could entail work with that potential customer.

00:50:23.534 --> 00:50:33.554
And, and, and like you, if you did that for early, early days with, um, loco, then people can get a sense like, huh, I never, I never thought of it that way.

00:50:33.914 --> 00:50:34.284
Right.

00:50:34.605 --> 00:50:35.034
Yeah.

00:50:35.074 --> 00:50:35.664
I dig that.

00:50:35.925 --> 00:50:41.844
Uh, and even in moving forward from there, like, okay, now I've got that baseline.

00:50:42.025 --> 00:50:42.445
Yeah.

00:50:42.864 --> 00:50:43.224
Yeah.

00:50:43.244 --> 00:50:44.525
And, you know, geez.

00:50:45.025 --> 00:50:49.905
I think it's just impressive for what you guys are doing at loco and number of businesses.

00:50:50.005 --> 00:50:51.824
I know you have a number of categories.

00:50:51.855 --> 00:50:56.405
So I love the fact that you've broken down the size and kind of the stage of growth at the end.

00:50:56.945 --> 00:51:04.085
Um, and that's my banking background, really just recognizing that different challenges are faced by different stages, you know?

00:51:04.144 --> 00:51:04.614
Yeah.

00:51:04.644 --> 00:51:09.574
So when you had that in the earliest days, you realized that, and they needed some different resources.

00:51:09.704 --> 00:51:10.085
Yeah.

00:51:10.085 --> 00:51:13.034
Well, we started really in the five to.

00:51:13.195 --> 00:51:25.085
20 employee second stage because so many people get up to that kind of six or eight employees and then they run out of their Capacity, you know that now they're managing everybody and they can't sell anymore.

00:51:25.085 --> 00:51:37.735
So the business goes into a funk Yeah, and they got all these salaries and stuff going on and and And so managing through that to get out of the, the whitewater of that kind of, you know, five or seven employee kind of realm.

00:51:38.304 --> 00:51:42.235
Um, and then over time, some of those early members grew a bunch.

00:51:42.675 --> 00:51:45.675
So now they got 30, 40, 50 employees, four or five years in.

00:51:45.675 --> 00:51:53.074
And so that's when we launched the next level, which was, you know, more of a direct competitor to the EO or Vistage type groups.

00:51:53.204 --> 00:51:53.505
Yeah.

00:51:53.505 --> 00:51:59.755
So, I mean, that's fascinating because you, they were, They would have had to leave to get the right experience.

00:51:59.764 --> 00:52:02.474
But they stayed because you built something for them as they needed something.

00:52:02.474 --> 00:52:04.045
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

00:52:04.630 --> 00:52:10.050
And same thing along the way of building those first several groups of the second stage, or the mid stage.

00:52:10.610 --> 00:52:18.699
Uh, I had to pass over a whole bunch of people because they were successful show openers, but you don't even manage any people, you know, so we don't have nothing for you.

00:52:18.769 --> 00:52:19.239
Yeah.

00:52:19.360 --> 00:52:21.219
Uh, and then it was like, well, could I?

00:52:21.579 --> 00:52:31.465
Cause I, I kind of assumed at that time that I couldn't charge them more than like, A hundred bucks a month or something like that that they were just all to and can I even do the administrative for that?

00:52:31.514 --> 00:52:33.804
And then actually I have to credit Moses Horner.

00:52:34.054 --> 00:52:45.074
Okay, longtime member with Horner painting as a member Oh sure, and then he's been running for over five years now The builders chapter so for that One to five employee demographic.

00:52:45.735 --> 00:52:49.744
And he's like, dude, if they can't pay 250 a month, you don't want them.

00:52:50.324 --> 00:52:50.855
That's a good way.

00:52:51.215 --> 00:52:54.635
And there's plenty of small businesses that can figure that out.

00:52:54.664 --> 00:52:59.894
And we're going to, and like half of his members have, should be moved up into the, into the.

00:53:00.005 --> 00:53:02.235
Next size now, but they don't want to leave their group.

00:53:02.235 --> 00:53:04.135
So I don't know how to fix that problem.

00:53:04.344 --> 00:53:04.815
Interesting.

00:53:04.824 --> 00:53:06.954
Um, I should probably just start charging them more.

00:53:08.355 --> 00:53:08.655
I don't know.

00:53:08.655 --> 00:53:09.724
I'll leave that between you two.

00:53:09.724 --> 00:53:10.244
Yeah.

00:53:10.244 --> 00:53:10.525
Yeah.

00:53:10.525 --> 00:53:19.965
Well, and all my other chapters too, it happens at times that, uh, you know, even some of the thinkers, like they have a big company that could move up, but then they're priced.

00:53:21.010 --> 00:53:21.559
Triples.

00:53:21.969 --> 00:53:22.349
Yeah.

00:53:22.389 --> 00:53:24.750
And maybe they won't like that new group as much, you know?

00:53:24.869 --> 00:53:25.349
True.

00:53:25.409 --> 00:53:27.369
So you have to balance the relationships that are there.

00:53:27.480 --> 00:53:28.599
Are they really getting fed?

00:53:28.610 --> 00:53:29.389
Yeah, it depends.

00:53:29.389 --> 00:53:29.949
Yeah.

00:53:30.130 --> 00:53:30.559
I don't know.

00:53:30.559 --> 00:53:31.034
I mean, I don't know.

00:53:31.625 --> 00:53:33.204
Like I said, I'm a fan of what you're doing.

00:53:33.215 --> 00:53:40.755
I think, uh, price is always just a hidden reason to have people have a better understanding what value is really there.

00:53:40.755 --> 00:53:45.625
And, um, I'm a big believer that you also, most companies can probably increase their prices.

00:53:45.625 --> 00:53:47.474
There's, we're all, we all have our own.

00:53:47.474 --> 00:53:49.385
That's the advice I've given more than any other.

00:53:49.614 --> 00:53:50.974
Yeah, self limiting beliefs, right?

00:53:51.085 --> 00:53:55.014
You're like, Oh, I don't know if I could do it because it, you know, exchanging value and I don't know if that price.

00:53:55.014 --> 00:54:00.135
And so you start mathing it out, which is really my, even our own experience in altitude.

00:54:00.135 --> 00:54:03.824
It's like, that doesn't, like, just because you math it out doesn't mean that's the price.

00:54:04.494 --> 00:54:06.715
That, because you just, there's a whole conversation about value.

00:54:07.224 --> 00:54:08.945
We're we're gonna jump in the time machine.

00:54:09.184 --> 00:54:10.744
Uh, take me and go back to Pittsburgh.

00:54:10.775 --> 00:54:11.945
Oh, tell me man.

00:54:11.945 --> 00:54:12.219
Let's, let's do it.

00:54:12.219 --> 00:54:13.864
Uh, but, uh, let's take a real short break.

00:54:13.925 --> 00:54:14.135
Okay.

00:54:14.135 --> 00:54:15.275
Let's do it because my drink is empty.

00:54:15.304 --> 00:54:16.054
Oh, okay.

00:54:16.054 --> 00:54:16.056
Okay.

00:54:16.114 --> 00:54:16.505
Let's do it.

00:54:55.268 --> 00:54:56.559
Four inventory right now.

00:54:56.559 --> 00:54:57.998
But it's cool, man.

00:54:57.998 --> 00:54:58.449
I dig it.

00:54:58.539 --> 00:54:58.869
Yeah.

00:54:58.869 --> 00:54:59.889
I take, and it's a cool setup.

00:54:59.889 --> 00:55:02.168
You gotta, you know, you got the right seems to be the right tool.

00:55:02.498 --> 00:55:06.188
I had a, a blue couch and an orange chair that were cool.

00:55:06.309 --> 00:55:06.518
Yeah.

00:55:06.548 --> 00:55:07.809
Uh, but one of my members.

00:55:07.978 --> 00:55:11.528
Does like commercial furnishings stuff.

00:55:11.528 --> 00:55:14.028
And she had, she had 14 of the chairs like this.

00:55:14.039 --> 00:55:17.159
So she gave me this and gave me the super good guy on the couch.

00:55:17.358 --> 00:55:19.208
Do you give her a shout out every once in a while to talk about her?

00:55:19.248 --> 00:55:20.418
Hey, Becky, love you.

00:55:21.298 --> 00:55:22.898
Rebecca Windsor and associates.

00:55:22.909 --> 00:55:23.548
There you go.

00:55:23.588 --> 00:55:25.039
Best in commercial design.

00:55:25.059 --> 00:55:27.228
Sound like free advertising, right?

00:55:27.309 --> 00:55:27.628
Yeah.

00:55:27.699 --> 00:55:29.268
No, she's a, she's awesome lady.

00:55:29.298 --> 00:55:29.659
I.

00:55:30.094 --> 00:55:38.873
Um, sold our, uh, I catered a bunco party for Becky, um, on referral from my mother in law when I was food trucking.

00:55:38.954 --> 00:55:39.724
Oh my God.

00:55:40.253 --> 00:55:41.853
Like Is that how the relationship got started?

00:55:41.963 --> 00:55:42.844
Originally, yeah.

00:55:42.844 --> 00:55:43.384
Yeah, small world.

00:55:43.463 --> 00:55:53.753
And then years and years later, after I had these next level chapters, I remembered, well, Becky had a really cool business and she was like, you know, I don't ever connect with anybody in our region.

00:55:53.764 --> 00:55:57.523
I'm just always doing business all around the country and I want some.

00:55:57.594 --> 00:55:57.994
Yeah.

00:55:58.123 --> 00:55:58.864
And she's been great.

00:55:59.123 --> 00:55:59.844
That's cool, man.

00:55:59.853 --> 00:55:59.893
Awesome.

00:55:59.893 --> 00:56:00.333
Yeah, it looks good.

00:56:01.268 --> 00:56:01.849
Yeah, no.

00:56:02.409 --> 00:56:03.378
Um, oh shoot.

00:56:04.079 --> 00:56:04.588
Pause.

00:56:05.369 --> 00:56:07.498
Um, talks about recording.

00:56:07.509 --> 00:56:08.619
It's like, oh it's recording.

00:56:08.708 --> 00:56:14.869
Moses, uh, my landlord had some Google glasses or some kind of fancy Oh, those, yep.

00:56:14.978 --> 00:56:18.398
Yeah, Bausch and Lomb, I think they are, or Ray Bans, they're Ray Bans.

00:56:18.898 --> 00:56:22.338
And they got little, I was like, are those like camera glasses or something?

00:56:22.398 --> 00:56:23.139
Was that the new AI?

00:56:23.148 --> 00:56:24.849
Yeah, yeah, something, yeah.

00:56:24.858 --> 00:56:25.088
Wow, okay.

00:56:25.099 --> 00:56:34.449
And, uh, So he was like, well, but it's blocked, so you can't like, it lights up, it won't record if you, if you'd have the light blocked.

00:56:34.498 --> 00:56:35.248
Interesting.

00:56:35.309 --> 00:56:36.559
Yeah, so you can't, uh.

00:56:36.909 --> 00:56:38.168
Phew, man, that's a crazy topic.

00:56:38.168 --> 00:56:38.748
Pretty intense.

00:56:38.759 --> 00:56:44.349
It won't be long before we just have, like, implantable cameras in one eye, so you can, you know.

00:56:44.398 --> 00:56:47.599
Yeah, kind of Tom Cruise, Matrix, Mission Impossible.

00:56:47.608 --> 00:56:52.449
Do the real, uh, uh, voyeur style, uh, porn creation.

00:56:52.449 --> 00:56:53.652
Oh my god.

00:56:53.652 --> 00:56:54.467
Sorry, that's wrong.

00:56:54.467 --> 00:56:56.349
You get to, you get to a point and, uh.

00:56:56.849 --> 00:57:00.798
With words, everything's going with AI, it's, it's, it's crazy.

00:57:00.809 --> 00:57:01.369
Yeah.

00:57:01.429 --> 00:57:01.818
Yeah.

00:57:02.449 --> 00:57:19.838
Actually, one of our members just invited me, one of her members is going to talk about how to use AI to really make sure you have all your SOPs and all that kind of stuff down, my team has been using it for some content stuff and just making things look pretty, but like just getting, Hey, chat GPT, write me a freaking HR manual.

00:57:19.838 --> 00:57:23.329
I've been meaning to for five years, you know, that's it.

00:57:23.329 --> 00:57:24.838
I mean, those are the examples that.

00:57:25.449 --> 00:57:33.639
You know, in the communities you and I operate in where you put the right formula in place and you punch it into, you name your AI tool.

00:57:33.719 --> 00:57:34.009
Yeah.

00:57:34.918 --> 00:57:36.588
It is crazy what it spits out.

00:57:36.668 --> 00:57:43.219
I mean, it might need a few edges polished and maybe someone to check and balance it, but I mean that, like, you're joking, I know.

00:57:44.168 --> 00:57:45.619
I know, but not really.

00:57:45.909 --> 00:57:55.088
We all have a list of things that we're all trying to get accomplished, and so just think about how it's going to be managed, but Hey, Chad, take my Optitude Growth Academy homework and take care of that for me.

00:57:55.798 --> 00:57:57.659
Might not be that quite that easy, that there might be.

00:57:57.659 --> 00:58:03.329
There might be people just acting as if that there's somebody else, you know, just read my website and see what my answers would be.

00:58:03.333 --> 00:58:03.818
That's right, that's right.

00:58:04.289 --> 00:58:05.128
Oh man.

00:58:05.398 --> 00:58:10.619
Um, so yeah, we're, uh, now is the, the part of the conversation where we jump in the time machine.

00:58:10.679 --> 00:58:11.039
Love it.

00:58:11.039 --> 00:58:12.449
And was it, were you born in Pittsburgh?

00:58:12.539 --> 00:58:12.989
I was.

00:58:13.018 --> 00:58:13.318
Okay.

00:58:13.318 --> 00:58:17.478
That's, uh, Pittsburgh, uh, back to the future.

00:58:17.699 --> 00:58:18.289
Here we are.

00:58:18.389 --> 00:58:18.849
Yeah.

00:58:19.648 --> 00:58:21.168
What were the circumstances?

00:58:21.498 --> 00:58:24.068
I grew up in Western PA, um.

00:58:24.079 --> 00:58:26.559
Your parents, your older kid, younger kid, older kid?

00:58:26.559 --> 00:58:27.219
I'm younger.

00:58:27.338 --> 00:58:28.329
Younger of two.

00:58:28.358 --> 00:58:29.909
My brother is three years older than me.

00:58:29.958 --> 00:58:30.228
Alright.

00:58:30.259 --> 00:58:31.599
Uh, shout out to him.

00:58:31.599 --> 00:58:33.628
He's a, he's a Colorado guy now.

00:58:33.628 --> 00:58:37.378
He's been out here for, uh, gosh, 25 plus years, almost 30.

00:58:37.978 --> 00:58:40.018
Um, I actually came out, I was visiting him.

00:58:40.438 --> 00:58:43.139
throughout my other, uh, business career.

00:58:43.139 --> 00:58:44.148
I was coming out to visit him.

00:58:44.179 --> 00:58:44.688
Oh, right.

00:58:44.739 --> 00:58:46.009
And so that's why you're here too.

00:58:46.039 --> 00:58:46.309
Yeah.

00:58:46.329 --> 00:58:47.018
I got turned on.

00:58:47.018 --> 00:58:49.268
If he hadn't been here first, you might not have been here as much.

00:58:49.268 --> 00:58:50.608
I think that's, that's pretty fair.

00:58:50.699 --> 00:58:50.858
Yeah.

00:58:50.858 --> 00:58:51.358
It's pretty fair.

00:58:51.358 --> 00:58:54.128
And what was the circumstances of your, your parents?

00:58:54.199 --> 00:58:58.358
Yeah, I grew up a wonderful family, uh, family life.

00:58:58.418 --> 00:59:05.139
Uh, if you can think about kind of seventies, eighties, I grew up, uh, blue collar parents, but I would say highly educated.

00:59:05.179 --> 00:59:05.989
I was lucky enough.

00:59:06.018 --> 00:59:09.739
Um, mom was, um, a nurse, clinical nurse by training.

00:59:09.820 --> 00:59:18.509
Uh, so ER kind of started in that realm and then wanted to get back into teaching as an academics, uh, teaching nursing.

00:59:18.559 --> 00:59:22.628
She went back out her, um, uh, next level, I think would have a master's.

00:59:22.628 --> 00:59:23.858
And then she completed her PhD.

00:59:23.858 --> 00:59:25.018
She became a doctor.

00:59:25.849 --> 00:59:26.108
Yeah.

00:59:26.108 --> 00:59:27.139
She didn't at the time.

00:59:27.139 --> 00:59:31.164
And, um, Unfortunately, both my parents passed in the last two years.

00:59:31.213 --> 00:59:31.523
I'm sorry.

00:59:31.804 --> 00:59:32.673
Yeah, thank you.

00:59:32.764 --> 00:59:36.173
Um, they, uh, she, you know, she didn't even want to get it.

00:59:36.184 --> 00:59:38.094
She was one of those people like, Oh gosh, I gotta get it.

00:59:38.143 --> 00:59:41.873
Cause when you're in the academic, uh, upper, you know, in college.

00:59:41.873 --> 00:59:42.204
Professor.

00:59:42.483 --> 00:59:43.974
It's kind of required to get tenure.

00:59:44.403 --> 00:59:48.378
So she went through the process and did it and ended up, um, Becoming a doctor.

00:59:48.409 --> 00:59:50.929
So she had her PhD, which was really impressive.

00:59:50.989 --> 00:59:56.389
And then my father was a social worker and his, uh, degree required a master's degree.

00:59:56.798 --> 01:00:10.518
So we, you know, my brother and I joked, we grew up in that era where the, the, the three things that were most important, uh, were, uh, you know, getting an education, getting a job, or finding a way to, to pay for your own means.

01:00:10.518 --> 01:00:12.039
And then, um.

01:00:12.664 --> 01:00:19.135
Having a value and cultural system that was related to prioritizing family and friends and community.

01:00:19.195 --> 01:00:25.275
Yeah, so it's very basic, but yeah, well at least I say that now because I've been out traveling around the world lucky enough.

01:00:25.889 --> 01:00:31.590
And yeah, we grew up with, uh, I think, you know, not only great parents, but a good secondary family.

01:00:31.590 --> 01:00:33.650
A lot of aunts and uncles and cousins on both sides.

01:00:33.769 --> 01:00:34.099
Cool.

01:00:34.630 --> 01:00:39.130
What was, uh, what were you like say at 10 years old?

01:00:39.139 --> 01:00:39.690
Early age?

01:00:39.719 --> 01:00:48.280
I mean, I, you know, I was, uh, I would say a self starter in some, some ways because of what I described to you, we weren't in a position where we just had everything.

01:00:48.380 --> 01:00:52.489
It was very much, if I, if I saw something I wanted at that early stage of my life.

01:00:53.099 --> 01:00:55.949
Well, especially while your mom was still pursuing education before she was.

01:00:56.385 --> 01:00:57.344
Making the big money.

01:00:57.405 --> 01:00:57.844
Yeah.

01:00:57.844 --> 01:01:01.074
And I don't know, they would probably tell you they never really made big money.

01:01:01.554 --> 01:01:03.315
Because there was always this conversation about.

01:01:03.449 --> 01:01:06.849
So here's, here's really what's available to do other things.

01:01:06.849 --> 01:01:13.269
And I was always, as I got older, I was like, wow, you know, they brought that you guys into that conversation.

01:01:13.550 --> 01:01:18.590
Like, do you want to go to the restaurant twice a month or do you want to save up and go to Disneyland?

01:01:18.710 --> 01:01:19.000
Yeah.

01:01:19.159 --> 01:01:19.809
Yes and no.

01:01:19.809 --> 01:01:33.679
I mean, it, it, it's interesting you're asking me that because it very much formed my, uh, relationship with money that if I wanted something that was not available to me based on the means that they had, they were very clear with.

01:01:34.070 --> 01:01:35.545
We don't have that money to pay for it.

01:01:35.550 --> 01:01:36.289
You have options.

01:01:36.320 --> 01:01:38.690
You have options, And I was like, well, what are those options?

01:01:39.110 --> 01:01:41.900
They're like, you have to, you have to work for yourself.

01:01:42.019 --> 01:01:42.230
Yeah.

01:01:42.289 --> 01:01:47.840
And those are the days, uh, where paper routes were popular before you were able to work legally.

01:01:47.929 --> 01:01:48.380
Yeah.

01:01:48.380 --> 01:01:48.380
Yeah.

01:01:48.469 --> 01:01:50.840
And so my brother had one, I had one.

01:01:50.840 --> 01:01:54.769
And the, the foundation of going to do a job.

01:01:55.155 --> 01:01:59.534
In this case, that work and then going, collecting the money to have someone pay for that.

01:01:59.565 --> 01:02:07.943
And then if you did a job at a different level, they tipped you and that became what you made on the, the margin of the work you did.

01:02:07.945 --> 01:02:15.679
And man, I got like, I look back and I'm thinking that had to be like the foundational of like, I do X and I get Y.

01:02:16.090 --> 01:02:19.119
The more X I get, I do better, better job, the more Y I get.

01:02:19.119 --> 01:02:21.289
So I just figured out this kind of give and take.

01:02:21.289 --> 01:02:23.280
Kind of a formula, uh, for that.

01:02:23.309 --> 01:02:23.809
Yeah.

01:02:23.969 --> 01:02:25.650
And I used it in other things in my life.

01:02:25.650 --> 01:02:26.730
So it was, it was fascinating.

01:02:26.750 --> 01:02:30.230
I, uh, I started my blog for, for October.

01:02:30.250 --> 01:02:31.849
I read a monthly blog too.

01:02:31.909 --> 01:02:32.130
Yeah.

01:02:32.130 --> 01:02:32.420
Nice.

01:02:32.420 --> 01:02:35.480
It's another four hours or something like that, that I should cut out of my life.

01:02:35.510 --> 01:02:35.858
Try it, try it.

01:02:35.860 --> 01:02:36.800
Have AI read it.

01:02:36.800 --> 01:02:37.559
Yeah, try that out.

01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:41.519
Uh, but the title is, uh, Fear and Profit at the Margins.

01:02:41.670 --> 01:02:42.250
Interesting.

01:02:42.570 --> 01:02:43.110
Tell me more.

01:02:43.280 --> 01:02:54.739
Well, like that raise your price, you know, you're not going to have a successful business if you don't get a little more margin out of it or you need to run your same operations.

01:02:54.795 --> 01:03:02.735
Um, and you need to figure out as an owner, how to get that into your margin or whatever.

01:03:02.744 --> 01:03:08.635
There's always fear associated with margin, but there's also profit associated with margin.

01:03:08.744 --> 01:03:09.224
Totally.

01:03:09.244 --> 01:03:13.505
You know, you're not going to get the profit if you don't overcome some of those fears along the way.

01:03:13.614 --> 01:03:13.925
Yeah.

01:03:13.925 --> 01:03:18.045
I mean, now we get really deep though, Kerr, because I'm at fear.

01:03:18.434 --> 01:03:19.894
Fear is the most limiting.

01:03:20.380 --> 01:03:27.570
emotion that I believe all of us as human beings have is that, and let's be honest, the fear is mostly in our head.

01:03:27.679 --> 01:03:28.090
Totally.

01:03:28.239 --> 01:03:30.309
Not, not something that's real.

01:03:30.909 --> 01:03:33.230
Um, I don't know if I was, that's funny.

01:03:33.230 --> 01:03:36.510
I don't know if I was learned anything about fear relative to money.

01:03:36.550 --> 01:03:37.623
I just knew it was about money.

01:03:37.875 --> 01:03:38.445
Hard work.

01:03:38.445 --> 01:03:41.224
I joked earlier, it's like the, you know, the blue collar hustle, it's just.

01:03:41.244 --> 01:03:45.795
Well, you got to go get the papers at four 30 in the morning and have them delivered by seven and go to school at eight or something.

01:03:45.795 --> 01:03:46.315
You got it.

01:03:46.364 --> 01:03:46.704
Yeah.

01:03:46.704 --> 01:03:48.085
And I still, I still get up that early.

01:03:48.085 --> 01:03:50.164
My wife's like, what are you doing?

01:03:50.164 --> 01:03:55.264
I was like, I started when I was young and, but yeah, so I learned, I learned that.

01:03:55.264 --> 01:03:59.764
And, um, and then, you know, from there, you, I don't want to say you graduate, but you're like, oh, how do I do more of that?

01:03:59.764 --> 01:04:04.614
And I started a lawn mowing business with a couple of friends of mine and then I was an athlete.

01:04:04.614 --> 01:04:05.355
So I played.

01:04:05.489 --> 01:04:10.530
I don't know, I played every possible sport in the earliest days, went in Western Pennsylvania, the popular sports.

01:04:10.539 --> 01:04:11.429
What were you best at?

01:04:11.719 --> 01:04:12.849
Uh, I was really popular.

01:04:12.980 --> 01:04:17.320
I was really good at football because that was the Western PAs got like this history of.

01:04:17.704 --> 01:04:24.275
A lot of plus Steeler nation, but also it's like a mini Texas kind of, in terms of high school football and stuff, right?

01:04:24.335 --> 01:04:24.704
Yeah.

01:04:24.704 --> 01:04:42.875
I mean, our, yeah, so that, that was why, why there's so much influence there, but I got into playing ice hockey, um, uh, at the, I would say a little later than most of the people, um, especially if you're from North Dakota, you probably know this, um, you know, you, you come out of a womb and North Dakota, South Dakota, Minnesota with, with ice skates on.

01:04:43.304 --> 01:04:45.514
And, and it's, you know, sticking a puck and ready to go.

01:04:45.554 --> 01:04:49.065
I did not get to that point till I was early, like, uh, 12.

01:04:49.244 --> 01:04:55.034
So I had to really up, you know, we, uh, my, my, I went to a school with only 50 kids in the high school.

01:04:55.445 --> 01:04:57.594
So we had a basketball team and a track team.

01:04:57.844 --> 01:04:58.295
Okay.

01:04:58.405 --> 01:05:01.179
Uh, no football team, no hockey team, no.

01:05:01.670 --> 01:05:03.820
Soccer team, no baseball team.

01:05:03.880 --> 01:05:05.909
I bet you athletes were playing all the sports.

01:05:06.019 --> 01:05:07.039
Didn't matter what they just played.

01:05:07.039 --> 01:05:09.099
Well, track and, and basketball.

01:05:09.179 --> 01:05:11.190
Yeah, so you just played, that was the thing you did.

01:05:11.190 --> 01:05:11.909
Those were the sports.

01:05:12.889 --> 01:05:15.900
And, and, I guess I grew up in a big, a bigger area.

01:05:16.119 --> 01:05:17.269
But I can relate because.

01:05:17.280 --> 01:05:19.269
So yeah, so I've never actually put ice skates on.

01:05:19.389 --> 01:05:20.019
Never have.

01:05:20.079 --> 01:05:20.750
Never have.

01:05:20.849 --> 01:05:21.619
It's cold enough up there.

01:05:21.619 --> 01:05:36.695
I can only go, um, Counterclockwise at the roller skating rink because I can pretty much only push with my right sure the pushing with my left doesn't really work So I'm swimming upstream all the time and it is the one thing Well, but I know a lot of hockey players for sure.

01:05:36.735 --> 01:05:42.275
I bet no one from that just neck of the woods I so here's the thing in Western, Pennsylvania at the time.

01:05:42.275 --> 01:05:45.840
They didn't have Uh, a lot of ice sheets or rinks.

01:05:46.909 --> 01:05:55.989
Uh, it wasn't a go all over the place or, and I think you might appreciate this or you learn what was, uh, learn a different way.

01:05:56.190 --> 01:06:00.400
And this is when the original Canadian company created the roller blade.

01:06:00.719 --> 01:06:04.710
Oh, so I, speaking about business, I had to buy my own.

01:06:05.010 --> 01:06:07.150
And I had to figure out how to get the money.

01:06:07.519 --> 01:06:15.090
So I threw different odd jobs I did, and then I had to send away the money for a connec I think Rollerblade was founded in Canada.

01:06:15.090 --> 01:06:15.670
It was brand new.

01:06:15.730 --> 01:06:21.929
Yeah, and these boots came that were so heavy, and like, everyone knows what rollerblades are today, but so different.

01:06:22.019 --> 01:06:22.360
Right.

01:06:22.409 --> 01:06:24.050
That's how I learned to skate.

01:06:24.099 --> 01:06:25.019
What year were you born?

01:06:25.239 --> 01:06:25.809
I was in 72.

01:06:26.465 --> 01:06:26.815
72.

01:06:26.844 --> 01:06:28.114
Oh, so you're actually older than me.

01:06:28.164 --> 01:06:28.635
I am.

01:06:28.635 --> 01:06:28.994
Dang.

01:06:29.014 --> 01:06:29.184
Yeah.

01:06:29.184 --> 01:06:31.335
I think you, cause you just turned, I just turned 50.

01:06:31.335 --> 01:06:32.675
So 74 was me.

01:06:32.945 --> 01:06:34.664
But yeah, we were peak roller blade nation.

01:06:34.724 --> 01:06:36.465
Like you were, you had early roller blade.

01:06:36.824 --> 01:06:37.255
Yeah.

01:06:37.284 --> 01:06:39.795
Those were like huge boots, cement boots with wheels on them.

01:06:40.755 --> 01:06:42.155
Um, but love to play.

01:06:42.155 --> 01:06:48.034
Cause I, I got into the love of it through street hockey, which then became super popular in roller hockey.

01:06:48.735 --> 01:06:57.684
And then I converted myself with a couple of friends of mine, just like, let's go play ice hockey and made my way through, um, uh, the gauntlet of doing that.

01:06:57.715 --> 01:07:02.635
And then was super excited that, uh, I got good enough in a quick period of time.

01:07:02.635 --> 01:07:06.755
I was a captain of the team and learned how to play at a high level and.

01:07:07.079 --> 01:07:09.079
You know, and, uh, I fell in love with it.

01:07:09.079 --> 01:07:09.820
Did you get a scholarship?

01:07:10.150 --> 01:07:12.039
No, unfortunately I didn't.

01:07:12.590 --> 01:07:18.369
I got to, uh, play on the club team at Bowling Green, uh, which was pretty cool because it was pretty competitive.

01:07:18.380 --> 01:07:28.349
These were guys that were all tier below being able to get, uh, any sort of scholarship and we went and played, uh, say Michigan state, Ohio state, IU.

01:07:29.230 --> 01:07:31.300
These were all kind of in that middle part.

01:07:31.300 --> 01:07:31.449
Yeah.

01:07:31.454 --> 01:07:31.594
Yeah.

01:07:31.659 --> 01:07:31.869
Fun.

01:07:31.875 --> 01:07:32.530
But it was, it was fun.

01:07:32.530 --> 01:07:35.320
It was just, it was, I love going to hockey games and, uh, yeah.

01:07:35.320 --> 01:07:37.570
So I definitely appreciate the, the sport.

01:07:37.929 --> 01:07:38.289
Yeah.

01:07:38.289 --> 01:07:40.239
That's one of, I'm probably not gonna play ever now though.

01:07:40.750 --> 01:07:41.710
Why did you play still?

01:07:42.099 --> 01:07:43.750
You know, I don't, I know some old guys that play.

01:07:43.780 --> 01:07:44.380
I know.

01:07:44.380 --> 01:07:45.400
What do you call me an old guy?

01:07:45.489 --> 01:07:47.110
Well, kind of, oh, shoot.

01:07:47.409 --> 01:07:48.099
Mean, I mean, ish.

01:07:48.159 --> 01:07:48.369
Yeah.

01:07:48.369 --> 01:07:54.699
I guess I am, but no, I, um, I don't, I said a, a guy, uh, that I'm friends with that just asked me the same question.

01:07:54.699 --> 01:07:58.639
He still plays, he's been playing for decades and a lot of my, uh.

01:07:59.085 --> 01:08:02.885
I played basketball until I was about 45, pretty consistently.

01:08:02.885 --> 01:08:06.775
Just gave it up because it was You know, I got injured pretty regularly.

01:08:06.775 --> 01:08:10.474
I broke my ribs in one game, and I started running more.

01:08:10.905 --> 01:08:12.804
For a while, running was my fitness thing.

01:08:12.885 --> 01:08:16.704
Uh, I've been, now I've just been drinking rye whiskey.

01:08:18.795 --> 01:08:18.854
Yeah.

01:08:18.854 --> 01:08:20.454
I'll ride my bike a little bit more too, but.

01:08:20.744 --> 01:08:22.274
I mean, Colorado is a fitness area.

01:08:22.274 --> 01:08:23.064
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:08:23.064 --> 01:08:24.425
Fitness, hiking, biking, and yeah.

01:08:24.534 --> 01:08:25.114
You do good stuff.

01:08:25.194 --> 01:08:26.914
I've been, yeah, I've been an athlete my whole life.

01:08:26.925 --> 01:08:27.954
So you went to Bowling Green.

01:08:27.954 --> 01:08:28.345
Where is that?

01:08:28.345 --> 01:08:29.645
Is that Indiana or something?

01:08:29.795 --> 01:08:31.284
No, there's a couple Bowling Greens.

01:08:31.284 --> 01:08:35.574
The one, the school I went to, uh, is south of Toledo, Ohio.

01:08:35.925 --> 01:08:37.505
So it's in the town of Bowling Green.

01:08:37.505 --> 01:08:37.555
Okay.

01:08:37.555 --> 01:08:42.425
So basically, I wouldn't say it's exactly like CSU, but it's got a similar vibe in Ohio.

01:08:42.425 --> 01:08:42.685
Yeah.

01:08:42.685 --> 01:08:42.944
Okay.

01:08:43.055 --> 01:08:44.484
It's Bowling Green State University.

01:08:44.484 --> 01:08:45.095
It is, okay.

01:08:45.095 --> 01:08:50.015
Yeah, so it's, it's in the realm of the same vibe of college town.

01:08:50.265 --> 01:08:50.515
Yep.

01:08:50.555 --> 01:08:52.585
So when, when the college is in session.

01:08:53.074 --> 01:08:55.375
Uh, the town like is vibrant, vibrant.

01:08:55.385 --> 01:08:57.274
And when the college students are not there.

01:08:57.274 --> 01:08:59.335
So, um, it was great.

01:08:59.555 --> 01:09:03.904
All the, all the, you know, a lot of guys I'm so friends with today are from that, from that time.

01:09:03.994 --> 01:09:05.564
And, um, yes.

01:09:05.564 --> 01:09:08.395
Did you go for like business administration or something?

01:09:09.444 --> 01:09:23.015
No, I thought I was going to go do, um, kind of running, um, I guess exercise physiology was kind of an area, or I could do like, uh, business sports management.

01:09:23.024 --> 01:09:28.185
Like those were two things I was trying to, and I needed some science, somebody's hockey team for him or something like that.

01:09:28.314 --> 01:09:29.095
Something like that.

01:09:29.095 --> 01:09:33.734
I mean, I don't know what can be, I mean, I was very much into athlete athletics at the time.

01:09:33.734 --> 01:09:38.744
And, um, so I kind of headed down that road and I didn't really use much of it at all.

01:09:38.774 --> 01:09:40.774
I actually pursued, what was your first real job?

01:09:41.484 --> 01:09:44.454
Gosh, my first real, well, let me, let me give you one other segment.

01:09:44.494 --> 01:09:49.074
So I actually went and went and got what I thought was going to be in another degree.

01:09:49.085 --> 01:09:49.604
Oh, okay.

01:09:49.604 --> 01:09:56.364
So I went back to Pennsylvania, Pittsburgh, went to the university of Pittsburgh and took science classes.

01:09:57.034 --> 01:10:16.789
I took those science classes for Oh gosh, I don't know, a couple semesters because I needed to get an increased amount of, uh, science credits because I thought I was going to go into physical therapy, uh, or exercise science, or, um, maybe even potentially go to, like, med school or PA school, right?

01:10:16.789 --> 01:10:18.760
I had all these things, so I was like, I'm going to do this healthcare track.

01:10:18.760 --> 01:10:21.069
You're going to get this inspiring, over educated parents and stuff.

01:10:21.079 --> 01:10:21.925
Yeah, that's right.

01:10:21.925 --> 01:10:23.130
So I was like, I should go do that.

01:10:23.189 --> 01:10:24.009
And then I was like, yeah.

01:10:24.350 --> 01:10:25.039
This is terrible.

01:10:25.039 --> 01:10:25.470
I hate this.

01:10:25.479 --> 01:10:27.920
Cause I was at that point, like, I still didn't have any money.

01:10:27.920 --> 01:10:29.680
I was living in the basement.

01:10:29.680 --> 01:10:30.770
You knew how to fix that.

01:10:30.869 --> 01:10:31.369
Yeah.

01:10:31.380 --> 01:10:33.914
And so then I was like, how about this?

01:10:33.914 --> 01:10:38.399
Why don't I leave there and go to North Carolina and continue to do that?

01:10:38.399 --> 01:10:43.399
So I went to Raleigh, North Carolina and pursued very similar types of tracks.

01:10:43.800 --> 01:10:45.640
Went to NC state at night.

01:10:46.350 --> 01:10:52.779
And worked part time as a fitness trainer at a, at a gym, uh, in, in, uh, in Raleigh.

01:10:53.390 --> 01:10:58.270
And then I had a, an awakening, which is I have, that was two and a half, almost three years out of college.

01:10:58.300 --> 01:11:03.930
And I don't think I had enough pennies rubbed together to get any further than paying my bills the month over month.

01:11:03.930 --> 01:11:04.250
Right.

01:11:04.979 --> 01:11:12.199
Um, so I sit down with my uncle, I was very, uh, very much, he was a mentor of mine, uh, that he had a successful.

01:11:12.845 --> 01:11:15.654
Uh, medical device and health technology sales.

01:11:15.904 --> 01:11:16.635
Well, of course you're broke.

01:11:16.635 --> 01:11:19.125
You make 18, 000 a year.

01:11:19.125 --> 01:11:19.725
Yeah, exactly.

01:11:20.625 --> 01:11:22.935
I was like, but how do you make apartment's 800 a month.

01:11:22.975 --> 01:11:23.375
That's right.

01:11:23.375 --> 01:11:24.555
He did the math really quickly.

01:11:24.564 --> 01:11:25.864
He's like, this isn't going to work for you.

01:11:26.335 --> 01:11:28.774
So he just gave me a, uh, kind of a one on one.

01:11:28.774 --> 01:11:30.005
He's like, you got to make some choices.

01:11:30.564 --> 01:11:34.354
And that's what, uh, got me on the track of getting into healthcare sales.

01:11:34.675 --> 01:11:35.465
Um, okay.

01:11:35.654 --> 01:11:37.704
And so I, then, you know, that's when you see.

01:11:37.704 --> 01:11:39.404
Did he have connections too besides?

01:11:39.404 --> 01:11:39.925
He did.

01:11:39.925 --> 01:11:39.963
He did.

01:11:39.965 --> 01:11:41.154
Uh, did not get.

01:11:41.220 --> 01:11:46.770
started with his company, but it taught me how to pursue a job of that significance.

01:11:47.109 --> 01:11:53.180
Um, because, you know, in those days and a, uh, day and age, they also wanted people with experience.

01:11:53.840 --> 01:11:57.890
I mean, even today, I guess some of the young kids probably still say, I don't want to experience what you got to get it somewhere.

01:11:58.649 --> 01:12:05.630
So, um, I just pursued, uh, being in healthcare sales for, I guess it took me about 18 months before I got my first gig.

01:12:05.800 --> 01:12:06.270
Oh, wow.

01:12:06.500 --> 01:12:10.909
And, uh, end up getting But at least you were working in the healthcare space while you were doing that kind of, right?

01:12:10.909 --> 01:12:14.109
So that lends some credibility, even if you haven't sold it much.

01:12:14.130 --> 01:12:16.470
I mean, that's what I use as my, as my position.

01:12:16.470 --> 01:12:17.680
I was like, how do you differentiate yourself?

01:12:17.680 --> 01:12:21.359
I got one thing, I'll use that at least.

01:12:21.579 --> 01:12:22.310
This is my nugget.

01:12:22.380 --> 01:12:23.329
I have a lot of background.

01:12:23.329 --> 01:12:24.369
I can speak the lingo.

01:12:24.369 --> 01:12:25.479
I understand healthcare.

01:12:25.539 --> 01:12:27.590
You know, vernacular vocabulary.

01:12:27.789 --> 01:12:28.899
And my uncle's in the space.

01:12:28.960 --> 01:12:29.430
That's right.

01:12:29.470 --> 01:12:32.069
And I could, I mean, you literally had to learn how to navigate a hospital.

01:12:32.079 --> 01:12:34.619
Like how to get, so anyway, so I did get started there.

01:12:34.619 --> 01:12:36.170
I started with a company called forest labs.

01:12:36.170 --> 01:12:38.020
They were a small company based out of New York.

01:12:38.020 --> 01:12:38.560
I think.

01:12:39.180 --> 01:12:52.719
Uh, I was only there for a couple of years and they're like trying to get hospitals to use their lab instead of another lab, it was mostly, um, internal medicine, family practitioner guys using just, um, stuff you would see in the clinic.

01:12:53.380 --> 01:12:53.739
Right.

01:12:53.750 --> 01:13:03.020
So you're like, yeah, tongue depressors, uh, there was some pharmaceuticals that were available that we, so we kind of sell like a truck, a trunk full of goods.

01:13:03.539 --> 01:13:04.430
Um, but it was great.

01:13:04.430 --> 01:13:08.699
Cause I, you know, I got a teeth cut and learned and it was very much traveled all around the country.

01:13:09.274 --> 01:13:10.895
I presume, or all around the region or whatever.

01:13:10.895 --> 01:13:11.595
Yeah, region.

01:13:11.625 --> 01:13:13.324
I was, you get in a car and go every day.

01:13:13.324 --> 01:13:15.095
But still, you see a whole bunch of new stuff.

01:13:15.125 --> 01:13:15.805
It was great.

01:13:15.814 --> 01:13:18.494
You know, uh, adventure for somebody like me or you, I think.

01:13:18.534 --> 01:13:19.284
It was awesome.

01:13:19.284 --> 01:13:23.765
And I didn't, you know, that's when you realize like, ah, this is how the other part of the world operates.

01:13:23.765 --> 01:13:26.515
And I luckily at that point had enough success.

01:13:26.515 --> 01:13:27.323
I got recruited.

01:13:27.324 --> 01:13:27.988
Yeah.

01:13:27.988 --> 01:13:36.425
Some do some, but I think they, well, I mean, yeah, yeah, in general, they're a big, big household brand.

01:13:36.454 --> 01:13:36.854
Totally.

01:13:36.925 --> 01:13:37.104
Yeah.

01:13:37.114 --> 01:13:45.324
Well, and they've got really strong programs for training people and like a whole bunch of really smart people have been through a Johnson and Johnson season.

01:13:45.425 --> 01:13:46.255
Totally man.

01:13:46.255 --> 01:13:48.074
I, then you hit the nail on the head, the training.

01:13:48.329 --> 01:13:49.550
was bar none the best.

01:13:49.550 --> 01:13:53.399
It wasn't fun when I was going through it, but on the back end, it was useful.

01:13:53.430 --> 01:13:54.600
It was super useful.

01:13:54.600 --> 01:14:00.979
I got, um, I got trained all the way up to be from individual contributor to learning how to manage and develop teams.

01:14:01.789 --> 01:14:02.859
So I got lucky enough.

01:14:02.859 --> 01:14:04.670
I got, I don't know if you got selected.

01:14:04.670 --> 01:14:08.000
You just got, you were foolish enough to take on the next responsibility.

01:14:08.720 --> 01:14:16.260
Um, I did that, uh, in Ohio and then, uh, and then I took on an opportunity to move to Minnesota, um, cause I had to take over.

01:14:16.560 --> 01:14:24.135
I don't know why I got, Pictured as this guy that could fix broken teams, broken businesses.

01:14:24.284 --> 01:14:27.135
That's from, and this is where it may be kind of as you're optimistic.

01:14:27.404 --> 01:14:28.595
I've had a good attitude.

01:14:28.664 --> 01:14:36.444
I pretty much always dab I've knocked on wood, you know, that I've, I've had that sort of positive attitude, but I had to go fix a really tough situation.

01:14:36.444 --> 01:14:38.685
It was a bottom, bottom dweller team.

01:14:39.444 --> 01:14:46.944
And, uh, it took me three years to turn it around, but we went from like, I don't know, like 40, 37 out of 40 in the country to number five.

01:14:47.479 --> 01:14:51.520
Um, so we turned, we turned that whole around and then that obviously gives you more opportunities.

01:14:51.550 --> 01:14:51.869
Sure.

01:14:52.199 --> 01:15:01.449
Um, I'm going fast forward through it, but then, uh, through that work, I was there for a number of years and then I wanted to pursue another path with another company.

01:15:01.979 --> 01:15:05.260
In that case, I, which took me to Denver, which was a company called Striker.

01:15:05.890 --> 01:15:07.210
Oh, yeah, hospital beds.

01:15:07.229 --> 01:15:08.630
Yeah, well, they have, yeah.

01:15:08.649 --> 01:15:09.350
Well, and more.

01:15:09.399 --> 01:15:10.220
They have more, yeah.

01:15:10.289 --> 01:15:12.390
We've got a gal named Pat Stryker that lives in town here.

01:15:12.390 --> 01:15:13.529
You've heard of her probably.

01:15:13.529 --> 01:15:20.029
I have heard of her and, uh, I'm certainly fond of her and her, uh, the company that, uh, I think it was her grandfather.

01:15:20.109 --> 01:15:20.449
I believe so.

01:15:20.470 --> 01:15:20.899
Yeah.

01:15:20.979 --> 01:15:25.289
Uh, Homer Stryker, uh, built and, uh, and created.

01:15:25.289 --> 01:15:27.979
So I was lucky enough to be there for a handful of years.

01:15:27.989 --> 01:15:28.963
Nice to sell pot.

01:15:28.965 --> 01:15:36.914
I don't know, probably the commission rate isn't quite the same.

01:15:37.064 --> 01:15:37.765
No, no.

01:15:37.765 --> 01:15:43.024
But it was, um, I mean, she striker is one of those, one of those companies that it can outfit.

01:15:43.024 --> 01:15:46.984
I think when I was there, I mean, you could outfit like 90 percent of a hospital.

01:15:46.994 --> 01:15:52.494
So they have, you know, implants, beds, stretchers, um, you know, spine, orthopedics.

01:15:52.515 --> 01:15:54.795
it became a healthcare behemoth.

01:15:54.805 --> 01:15:58.935
And to this day, still, still a great company and great culture.

01:15:58.984 --> 01:15:59.854
Um, cool.

01:15:59.935 --> 01:16:02.194
Very much a, uh, uh, go getters culture.

01:16:02.194 --> 01:16:06.574
So that eventually took me there and then, uh, pulled me in.

01:16:06.574 --> 01:16:07.904
Where'd you meet your wife?

01:16:08.024 --> 01:16:10.664
Uh, here in Colorado, it was kind of the sprout of optitude.

01:16:10.755 --> 01:16:13.024
It was actually not too long after I moved to Colorado.

01:16:13.265 --> 01:16:18.435
Um, I was here for, I want to say almost 18 months to a little less than two years.

01:16:18.435 --> 01:16:19.645
And in that timeframe.

01:16:19.920 --> 01:16:21.810
Um, you know, I was on the road.

01:16:21.810 --> 01:16:22.819
I had a huge region.

01:16:22.819 --> 01:16:30.199
I had, um, I had, uh, essentially almost west of the Mississippi, all the way to Hawaii and Alaska for a striker.

01:16:30.210 --> 01:16:31.279
It was a smaller division.

01:16:31.310 --> 01:16:31.460
Yeah.

01:16:31.460 --> 01:16:33.729
I was going to say, you must've been selling a specialty thing then.

01:16:33.739 --> 01:16:37.250
Cause it was, it was a specialty, uh, interventional spine.

01:16:37.250 --> 01:16:39.560
And it was, um, it was crazy.

01:16:39.560 --> 01:16:40.670
Cause I was on a plane all the time.

01:16:40.670 --> 01:16:41.119
I was gone.

01:16:41.149 --> 01:16:43.960
So the reason I say that is because it was really hard to have a relationship.

01:16:43.960 --> 01:16:45.859
I was gone all the time.

01:16:45.859 --> 01:16:48.649
So long, uh, long, that track.

01:16:50.010 --> 01:16:51.119
It is a funny story.

01:16:51.119 --> 01:16:54.220
I was introduced to, like, one of my colleagues, right?

01:16:54.229 --> 01:17:00.020
Stryker, we had a shared office, and he was like, Hey, you know, my wife and I are going out to dinner.

01:17:00.060 --> 01:17:01.920
You know, when you're new in town, people do that.

01:17:01.920 --> 01:17:02.750
They invite you out.

01:17:02.770 --> 01:17:03.199
Yeah, yeah.

01:17:03.199 --> 01:17:03.939
It's awfully kind.

01:17:04.449 --> 01:17:04.899
Um.

01:17:05.210 --> 01:17:06.539
And so I'm out to dinner with them.

01:17:06.539 --> 01:17:09.130
It was just myself and, uh, he and his wife.

01:17:09.130 --> 01:17:13.680
And then she started telling me about her sister and I was like, Oh, okay.

01:17:13.770 --> 01:17:15.189
Um, where's this going to go?

01:17:15.199 --> 01:17:17.939
And I was just, just, you know, newly kind of landed.

01:17:17.939 --> 01:17:21.189
And, um, she eventually said, well, you should meet her at some point.

01:17:21.189 --> 01:17:23.020
I'm like, ah, I'm not, I'm not interested.

01:17:23.020 --> 01:17:25.300
And at that stage, it wasn't that I wasn't appreciative.

01:17:25.529 --> 01:17:25.720
Yeah.

01:17:26.159 --> 01:17:28.229
Um, and so we didn't meet.

01:17:28.569 --> 01:17:32.909
Well, the reason I tell you that front of the story is the back part of this story is.

01:17:33.960 --> 01:17:36.590
I think it was about a year later, less than a year.

01:17:36.630 --> 01:17:44.880
I am, um, in, uh, Aspen, Colorado, which I'd never been to, uh, with some friends that were like, Oh, you got to come up here.

01:17:44.890 --> 01:17:46.069
It's a really cool thing.

01:17:46.079 --> 01:17:47.699
You're doing the Labor Day weekend for the weekend.

01:17:47.699 --> 01:17:47.920
Yeah.

01:17:47.979 --> 01:17:48.779
I don't know if you've ever been to labor.

01:17:48.779 --> 01:17:50.109
It's a music festival.

01:17:50.159 --> 01:17:53.430
Oh, I haven't been to Telluride bluegrass and blues and brews.

01:17:53.869 --> 01:17:54.899
So same deal.

01:17:54.899 --> 01:17:59.390
I think it's called, I think it's jazz or something, a steamboat for some kind of a fest too.

01:17:59.479 --> 01:18:03.668
It's like, but in your, you know, buttermilk, obviously it's the mountain area where the outside.

01:18:04.109 --> 01:18:15.409
So I go up there for that Labor Day weekend, um, and come to find that one of the couple guys I'm with, they have a group of other friends and this gal is in this group.

01:18:15.489 --> 01:18:18.859
And man, I, I, you know, strike up a conversation.

01:18:18.869 --> 01:18:20.680
She's local from Colorado.

01:18:20.680 --> 01:18:21.619
I start to talk to her.

01:18:21.619 --> 01:18:24.199
We, excuse me, get to know each other.

01:18:24.229 --> 01:18:24.850
And then.

01:18:25.364 --> 01:18:33.795
Long story short, Kurt, this woman is the sister of the guy I worked with.

01:18:33.835 --> 01:18:34.744
I love small world stuff.

01:18:34.755 --> 01:18:36.715
This small world, man, it was crazy.

01:18:36.715 --> 01:18:40.774
We were, um, it come to, she also was like, not interested in meeting at the time.

01:18:41.755 --> 01:18:42.914
But there we go.

01:18:43.074 --> 01:18:48.739
You found it out during that conversation that that's That was, yeah, we were like, you're, you're You're the sister?

01:18:48.760 --> 01:18:49.569
Like, get out of here.

01:18:50.520 --> 01:18:52.399
So, uh, so it is a fun story.

01:18:52.430 --> 01:18:54.949
We, uh, we feel very lucky that we met each other.

01:18:54.949 --> 01:18:57.750
And then, uh, four, four years later, we got married.

01:18:57.750 --> 01:18:59.619
So we, we celebrated our 10th anniversary last year.

01:18:59.619 --> 01:19:00.529
Oh, congratulations.

01:19:00.560 --> 01:19:01.819
And does this person have a name?

01:19:02.170 --> 01:19:03.590
Yeah, her name is Anika.

01:19:03.760 --> 01:19:04.260
Anika.

01:19:04.350 --> 01:19:04.729
Yeah.

01:19:04.840 --> 01:19:09.529
And what, what's her Yeah, her business, she's an interior designer.

01:19:09.600 --> 01:19:09.850
Okay.

01:19:09.850 --> 01:19:18.340
She went to CSU, uh, which is, yeah, anyone knows it's a very popular school for interior design, uh, I think one of the top in the country, at least that's what I've been told.

01:19:18.739 --> 01:19:23.340
Um, she, uh, started for a commercial for residential.

01:19:23.350 --> 01:19:23.930
Good question.

01:19:23.939 --> 01:19:25.199
So she started out in residential.

01:19:25.555 --> 01:19:30.515
Uh, through residential and kind of, um, uh, high end custom homes, right?

01:19:30.515 --> 01:19:34.585
And then through there started, uh, kind of branching into commercial.

01:19:35.085 --> 01:19:39.515
And then in the last decade, her business has been focused in senior living communities.

01:19:39.574 --> 01:19:39.914
Oh yeah.

01:19:40.164 --> 01:19:42.215
So, you know, kind of full circle, right?

01:19:42.265 --> 01:19:47.225
And um, Takes us back to that senior living community, uh, target customer thing.

01:19:47.255 --> 01:19:48.234
You got it, right?

01:19:48.234 --> 01:19:49.215
So full circle.

01:19:49.215 --> 01:19:54.164
And so it's amazing to see the kind of work that, that, uh, her and her firm are able to do.

01:19:54.215 --> 01:19:55.704
Um, So you're a pretty old guy.

01:19:56.069 --> 01:19:58.250
Uh, already by the time you guys met.

01:19:58.569 --> 01:19:58.930
Yeah.

01:19:58.939 --> 01:20:00.640
I was, yeah, yeah, right.

01:20:00.640 --> 01:20:05.050
I would definitely, it was, uh, late and far as lifelong bachelor, pretty much.

01:20:05.050 --> 01:20:07.930
I mean, I was no engagements, no engagements.

01:20:07.949 --> 01:20:13.350
Um, I was lucky enough, uh, that I had, uh, such a great career.

01:20:13.524 --> 01:20:16.265
Yeah, I was very much gone a ton.

01:20:16.335 --> 01:20:18.244
And so you're focused exploring.

01:20:18.324 --> 01:20:26.895
Yeah, it was really hard to do that, but I was thankful when we met, because I was, I mean, being on the road as a sales guy, man's game, it's, it's really hard to get out.

01:20:26.895 --> 01:20:34.904
Was that part of the motivation for starting up to two it is being like, I could be on the road a lot for the next 10 years, or I could not.

01:20:35.204 --> 01:20:35.685
You got it.

01:20:35.685 --> 01:20:36.225
Do that.

01:20:36.725 --> 01:20:38.875
It was, it was totally part of the motivator.

01:20:39.005 --> 01:20:45.324
Um, and as you heard me, you know, in the earlier part of our conversation, it's, you also get around people that, Oh, like that's possible.

01:20:45.505 --> 01:20:48.875
Like there's not even a, a self limiting beliefs that you can't do it.

01:20:48.875 --> 01:20:50.234
I'm like, I guess you're right.

01:20:50.555 --> 01:20:51.505
Yeah, let's go do it.

01:20:51.805 --> 01:20:58.720
So, um, yeah, so it was, I don't want to say match made in heaven, but we, we, we see the world very similar.

01:20:58.720 --> 01:21:03.239
We grew up similarly with similar values and the business side just makes it more fun there.

01:21:03.300 --> 01:21:03.479
Yeah.

01:21:03.850 --> 01:21:09.510
Um, should we, like, I feel like we kind of basically caught back up on the timeline.

01:21:09.510 --> 01:21:10.934
Do you want to jump into the timeline?

01:21:11.194 --> 01:21:12.935
The faith family politics.

01:21:12.935 --> 01:21:13.975
Uh, give it to me.

01:21:13.975 --> 01:21:15.454
And it feels like we should start with family.

01:21:15.534 --> 01:21:15.784
Okay.

01:21:16.185 --> 01:21:19.765
Um, why, why did you guys click so easy?

01:21:19.765 --> 01:21:21.885
You, you mentioned shared values.

01:21:21.954 --> 01:21:22.395
Yeah.

01:21:22.585 --> 01:21:25.484
Um, how do we see the world?

01:21:25.484 --> 01:21:29.074
I mean, yeah, I'm not, I didn't probably know it at that time.

01:21:29.074 --> 01:21:30.545
Like I didn't see relationships.

01:21:30.545 --> 01:21:31.795
Like, Hey, what are your values?

01:21:31.795 --> 01:21:32.634
Right.

01:21:32.635 --> 01:21:32.664
Right.

01:21:32.675 --> 01:21:33.364
You know, we just hit it.

01:21:33.364 --> 01:21:34.375
You obviously hit it off.

01:21:34.414 --> 01:21:35.635
We did socially.

01:21:35.675 --> 01:21:37.345
Uh, we had similar.

01:21:39.175 --> 01:21:41.694
friend, like we had friend groups and common friends already.

01:21:41.734 --> 01:21:42.024
Yeah.

01:21:42.135 --> 01:21:43.444
Common friends, families.

01:21:43.494 --> 01:21:46.305
I mean, well now family, but at the time it was common friends.

01:21:46.314 --> 01:21:46.774
Right.

01:21:47.114 --> 01:21:51.045
Um, we both were, we grew up in family, uh, environments.

01:21:51.045 --> 01:21:58.715
What I mean by that is that our parents and our, um, Our relationship and what we did in our social life was surrounding family.

01:21:58.774 --> 01:22:01.685
Like, she has a sister, one sister, I have one brother.

01:22:01.725 --> 01:22:02.135
Right.

01:22:02.204 --> 01:22:05.595
Um, she, uh, has two sets of parents, which is kind of cool.

01:22:05.875 --> 01:22:11.975
Uh, and I have one, but we were, a lot of what we did when we spoke about our earlier years was around family.

01:22:11.994 --> 01:22:12.255
Yeah.

01:22:12.529 --> 01:22:15.460
And so it, you know, the experiences that you value kind of thing.

01:22:15.470 --> 01:22:15.850
Bingo.

01:22:16.050 --> 01:22:18.949
And, uh, that, that was a big part of it.

01:22:19.000 --> 01:22:24.739
Um, she was a bunch more of a traveler as in, and Anika loves to travel.

01:22:24.739 --> 01:22:26.630
Like for fun, not for work.

01:22:26.689 --> 01:22:28.663
But I was a traveler because I, you know.

01:22:28.914 --> 01:22:32.364
Had to and enjoyed it, but felt, fell more in love with the travel.

01:22:32.404 --> 01:22:38.274
And then that bond created the curiosity where she's like, well, she's like, do you like to travel?

01:22:38.274 --> 01:22:41.045
I'm like, yeah, she's, you ever been to, she started rattling off like countries.

01:22:41.045 --> 01:22:43.265
I'm like, no, I didn't, I didn't travel that much.

01:22:43.314 --> 01:22:53.635
I've been to Europe once, maybe Australia, New York, a bunch of times in Dallas, Mexico, Canada, and, uh, Cancun and all that, you know, the hotspots.

01:22:53.645 --> 01:22:57.685
And so that was a fueled kind of passion with each other.

01:22:57.694 --> 01:22:57.864
Yeah.

01:22:57.864 --> 01:22:57.954
Yeah.

01:22:57.954 --> 01:22:58.123
Yeah.

01:22:58.454 --> 01:23:00.435
Uh, we both are athletes.

01:23:00.444 --> 01:23:05.064
She, um, was a skier her whole life, uh, as I talked about my background athlete.

01:23:05.064 --> 01:23:06.175
So we started from here.

01:23:06.244 --> 01:23:06.444
Yeah.

01:23:06.444 --> 01:23:06.935
She's from here.

01:23:06.965 --> 01:23:07.914
She grew up in Colorado.

01:23:08.824 --> 01:23:11.185
Um, so yeah, that's the main skiers in Indiana.

01:23:11.255 --> 01:23:12.204
No, totally.

01:23:12.914 --> 01:23:13.555
Pennsylvania.

01:23:14.795 --> 01:23:19.204
So we, uh, we, we obviously had that sort of excitement and, uh, that started to blossom.

01:23:19.204 --> 01:23:20.015
So family.

01:23:20.284 --> 01:23:26.385
Travel, curiosity about life, um, outdoors and athletics, and then business.

01:23:26.795 --> 01:23:30.265
You know, those that were a common kind of, uh, scenarios.

01:23:30.305 --> 01:23:31.244
Do you guys have littles?

01:23:31.385 --> 01:23:32.255
We do not have kids.

01:23:32.295 --> 01:23:32.664
Okay.

01:23:32.675 --> 01:23:33.185
We do not have kids.

01:23:33.185 --> 01:23:34.555
So you're dinks as well.

01:23:34.604 --> 01:23:36.265
Yeah, that's exactly right.

01:23:36.274 --> 01:23:38.475
Have you hosted any exchange students or anything yet?

01:23:38.524 --> 01:23:39.125
We haven't.

01:23:39.135 --> 01:23:40.125
You know, you said something.

01:23:40.125 --> 01:23:40.725
Have we talked about that?

01:23:40.975 --> 01:23:45.835
Well, you had said something to me in a phone call we had not too long ago, and I was fascinated by that.

01:23:45.835 --> 01:23:46.713
I think that's such a story.

01:23:46.904 --> 01:23:47.595
Amazing.

01:23:47.614 --> 01:23:56.494
I think it's like a neat thing for dinks to do if you don't have the guts or the fortitude or the compassion to be a foster parent.

01:23:56.635 --> 01:23:57.005
Yeah.

01:23:57.305 --> 01:24:09.064
Um, to be an exchange host parent is like a much lighter lift, but also for somebody with a travel vocab, you know, do a semester, do a, do a quarter or something even.

01:24:09.520 --> 01:24:09.880
I don't know.

01:24:09.890 --> 01:24:10.479
With a family.

01:24:10.890 --> 01:24:11.989
You guys would dig it probably.

01:24:12.020 --> 01:24:13.703
Yeah, we should talk a lot about it.

01:24:13.703 --> 01:24:15.536
Now that her business is pretty stable and whatever.

01:24:15.536 --> 01:24:16.420
Yeah, it would be.

01:24:16.930 --> 01:24:22.979
We did have a stint where we were pursuing, uh, you know, potential foster, uh, foster family.

01:24:22.989 --> 01:24:25.180
We, uh, went on a mission trip.

01:24:25.555 --> 01:24:28.805
Um, and our fifth wedding anniversary, we went to Guatemala.

01:24:28.904 --> 01:24:29.345
Oh, wow.

01:24:29.744 --> 01:24:34.345
And it was, yeah, we were like, I mean, it was, I'll tell you what.

01:24:34.385 --> 01:24:38.994
Um, I don't know if you've had that experience from a faith standpoint, if we're going to go family faith.

01:24:39.055 --> 01:24:39.395
Sure.

01:24:39.704 --> 01:24:43.034
Um, we, uh, I grew up Catholic.

01:24:43.114 --> 01:24:45.805
Um, I think she grew up, I think it was Methodist.

01:24:45.875 --> 01:24:52.564
Um, And, you know, I'm one of those many Catholics that you had been very active after that.

01:24:52.595 --> 01:24:53.564
No, exactly.

01:24:53.675 --> 01:24:56.645
Uh, but, but I'm, you know, a very much, uh, faith driven individual.

01:24:56.694 --> 01:24:56.895
Yeah.

01:24:56.895 --> 01:25:01.085
Um Well, I mean, your family values and stuff that you were talking about were certainly Bingo.

01:25:01.135 --> 01:25:01.864
impacted by that.

01:25:01.904 --> 01:25:02.234
Yeah.

01:25:02.625 --> 01:25:05.404
I'm big, I'm a big believer, uh, you know, in a higher power.

01:25:05.404 --> 01:25:14.824
And, uh, we got connected to our church in our local community in Denver and they had gone, they go to, they'd gone to Juarez, Mexico and Guatemala.

01:25:15.479 --> 01:25:19.470
Uh, uh, a town called Keisha Yah, uh, twonce a year.

01:25:19.489 --> 01:25:20.810
So they went to each of those once a year.

01:25:20.840 --> 01:25:23.979
And we kept getting interested in it, but we were like, you know, when is the right time?

01:25:23.979 --> 01:25:25.489
And let's be honest, there's never a right time.

01:25:25.579 --> 01:25:25.869
Yeah, yeah.

01:25:26.060 --> 01:25:29.640
So we got figured out we were going to go, um Oh, what a cool thing.

01:25:29.729 --> 01:25:40.435
And we went to, in the middle ofI would say it was the middle of the I mean, because anniversary is usually when you Celebrate yourselves and you live a decadent kind of a weekend or a long week, week and a half.

01:25:40.444 --> 01:25:41.284
Yeah, this is not that.

01:25:42.024 --> 01:25:54.324
Yeah, you were digging a well or We built a kitchen at a small, I'm talking how I would think about the outskirts of small town Guatemala and Central America, right?

01:25:54.385 --> 01:25:58.175
And then This community had next to nothing.

01:25:58.395 --> 01:26:02.005
Like they barely, I don't know if they even had running, what we would consider running water.

01:26:02.034 --> 01:26:02.435
Wow.

01:26:02.784 --> 01:26:08.284
So the church that we were associated with had been already in relationship with them for a number of years.

01:26:08.284 --> 01:26:12.715
So each year we kept trying to build the community, a resource in the community.

01:26:12.715 --> 01:26:13.175
And this.

01:26:14.319 --> 01:26:14.939
scenario.

01:26:14.970 --> 01:26:17.699
We had, we had put some money into the school in the community.

01:26:17.739 --> 01:26:20.439
Now we're, we were building a, um, a community kitchen.

01:26:20.739 --> 01:26:27.479
Oh, well, to help them make food for the, for the, uh, for the community, but also potentially to sell or something like that.

01:26:27.550 --> 01:26:28.659
Whatever it was.

01:26:28.760 --> 01:26:29.090
Yeah.

01:26:29.090 --> 01:26:31.925
And we went down there, um, It was mind blowing.

01:26:32.435 --> 01:26:36.435
It was, talk about ripping your, uh, you know, your heart strings, man.

01:26:36.444 --> 01:26:39.505
It was watching these kids, how excited they were.

01:26:39.515 --> 01:26:39.885
Yeah.

01:26:39.984 --> 01:26:50.354
Like there's, I just heard that China, part of the reason China's building a vehicle factory in Mexico is because the average labor rate is actually lower in Mexico than it is in China now.

01:26:50.414 --> 01:26:51.185
Is that right?

01:26:51.555 --> 01:26:51.805
Yeah.

01:26:51.835 --> 01:26:52.895
I can see that maybe.

01:26:52.944 --> 01:26:53.954
For, for pure labor.

01:26:54.104 --> 01:26:54.975
From a world economy.

01:26:54.984 --> 01:26:56.465
Now China doesn't have any regulations.

01:26:56.619 --> 01:27:09.979
So, uh, you know, there's other exterior costs that are different, but yeah, but there's real, there's a lot more real poverty in Guatemala, especially, or like Bangladesh or some of these other countries you don't hear that much about than there are.

01:27:10.539 --> 01:27:11.479
Most of the rest of the world.

01:27:11.569 --> 01:27:11.930
Yeah.

01:27:12.270 --> 01:27:14.359
Like just real resource less ness.

01:27:14.409 --> 01:27:17.819
Yeah, I mean, is it, I get Or resourcefulness, I don't know.

01:27:18.010 --> 01:27:19.300
Yeah, I'm following you.

01:27:19.300 --> 01:27:24.260
At the end of the day, there's, if you want to use Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, like the food, shelter, water stage.

01:27:24.310 --> 01:27:24.880
Right.

01:27:25.000 --> 01:27:26.469
That, that's what, that's what this, this is.

01:27:26.470 --> 01:27:27.279
uh, challenges.

01:27:27.920 --> 01:27:28.729
They're trying to get there.

01:27:28.770 --> 01:27:29.159
Yeah.

01:27:29.229 --> 01:27:32.529
I mean, and to me that's, that's mind blowing.

01:27:32.529 --> 01:27:36.289
Food, shelter, water is like the givens for us here in Northern Colorado.

01:27:36.800 --> 01:27:37.729
Plus some, I bet.

01:27:37.739 --> 01:27:42.590
Food, shelter, water means you have potentially easy access to craft beer.

01:27:42.649 --> 01:27:42.869
Yeah.

01:27:43.819 --> 01:27:44.119
Right?

01:27:44.550 --> 01:27:45.750
And someone knows somebody.

01:27:45.770 --> 01:27:46.420
Bicycle.

01:27:46.420 --> 01:27:47.445
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:27:47.445 --> 01:27:48.814
So uh, it was.

01:27:48.814 --> 01:27:49.498
Oh, cool.

01:27:49.500 --> 01:27:50.079
It was cool.

01:27:50.079 --> 01:27:57.180
We, our church goes to Czech a lot, members, Czechoslovakia, which is also a fascinating place to send missionaries.

01:27:57.770 --> 01:28:01.619
Less for the financial poverty and more for the spiritual poverty.

01:28:01.760 --> 01:28:02.260
Is that right?

01:28:02.260 --> 01:28:03.640
There's not a lot of spiritual belief there?

01:28:03.670 --> 01:28:08.770
No, the Russians really stamped out, like, it's almost, like, 98 percent atheist.

01:28:08.850 --> 01:28:09.399
Oh, wow.

01:28:09.409 --> 01:28:10.159
I had no idea.

01:28:10.170 --> 01:28:11.689
Um, so it's an interesting place.

01:28:11.930 --> 01:28:14.130
And it never really got very churchy.

01:28:14.180 --> 01:28:14.579
Sure.

01:28:14.795 --> 01:28:23.715
Compared to a lot of other places in Europe like, you know, Northern Europe and you know, wherever Luther had a big impact They're still wearing crosses even if they never go to church.

01:28:24.074 --> 01:28:27.244
No doubt I mean you can't you got it kind of ingrained out of the earliest days.

01:28:27.255 --> 01:28:27.694
Yeah.

01:28:27.694 --> 01:28:35.765
Yeah So so anyway, so you guys go down there and have this really transformative experience Did not quite pull the trigger on no, we were having a kid couple years.

01:28:35.765 --> 01:28:37.699
We did Research.

01:28:37.739 --> 01:28:44.680
We, we talked to some friends that had done it and, uh, realized that the process was pretty intense, which, which is a whole nother conversation.

01:28:44.680 --> 01:28:46.010
I think it should be way easier.

01:28:46.300 --> 01:28:46.800
I think so too.

01:28:47.039 --> 01:28:49.850
It should be almost a grab one off the shelf kind of thing.

01:28:50.199 --> 01:28:50.699
If you can.

01:28:51.725 --> 01:28:59.494
If you can prove that you're obviously safe and you have means to support then yeah, I mean, I that's the easy way so hard Yeah, good things so hard totally.

01:28:59.774 --> 01:29:13.210
I mean there I can tell you right now I can still see some of the kids very vividly in my head of when we were leaving on our bus it was like They're never going to leave there.

01:29:13.840 --> 01:29:15.739
Like, they're never going to get out of this community.

01:29:16.220 --> 01:29:19.340
I don't care how much resources we give them.

01:29:19.890 --> 01:29:21.189
You know, just the basics aren't there.

01:29:21.189 --> 01:29:22.439
Education, understanding.

01:29:23.369 --> 01:29:27.960
So, um, sad enough, but um, Yeah, it was game changing for us.

01:29:27.960 --> 01:29:31.710
But then we, uh, So, talk to me about faith while we're here in this segment.

01:29:31.720 --> 01:29:39.260
Like, Uh, you were a Catholic background as well, and so was your No, Anika, uh, I think it was Methodist.

01:29:39.350 --> 01:29:40.270
Okay, yeah, you mentioned that.

01:29:40.300 --> 01:29:46.239
And she wasn't, um So when we got together, we had a non denominational wedding.

01:29:46.489 --> 01:29:46.670
Yeah.

01:29:46.670 --> 01:29:47.930
We got married in Telluride, actually.

01:29:47.979 --> 01:29:48.380
Oh, cool.

01:29:48.409 --> 01:29:49.649
Yeah, we were It's a great place.

01:29:49.920 --> 01:29:52.659
Every time I go to Telluride, there's a double rainbow over Main Street.

01:29:52.869 --> 01:29:55.755
Ha! So we've been down there plenty of times.

01:29:55.755 --> 01:29:57.215
I mean, you've seen double rainbows.

01:29:57.215 --> 01:29:58.845
We're like, is this, is this normal?

01:29:58.854 --> 01:29:59.425
I don't know.

01:29:59.664 --> 01:29:59.895
Yeah.

01:30:00.175 --> 01:30:01.795
Maybe not every time, but just about.

01:30:01.824 --> 01:30:03.055
It's kind of stupid at this point.

01:30:03.055 --> 01:30:05.274
It's a special, like it's really remarkable.

01:30:05.295 --> 01:30:07.435
Totally hard to get to in the winter.

01:30:07.435 --> 01:30:08.375
Hard to do it in the summer.

01:30:08.385 --> 01:30:10.194
Even if you want to drive it, you got to be committed.

01:30:10.204 --> 01:30:15.944
My most extreme concert experience was the Telluride bluegrass festival back in 2011.

01:30:16.055 --> 01:30:16.414
Okay.

01:30:16.505 --> 01:30:17.604
And we were there.

01:30:18.395 --> 01:30:23.984
Everybody left because it rained all day on Sunday and so we got like right up front row for Mumford and Sons in the rain.

01:30:24.675 --> 01:30:32.515
And then the rain cleared, nobody was left, and Page and Plant came on with, along with the sun.

01:30:32.625 --> 01:30:33.045
Yeah.

01:30:33.045 --> 01:30:36.385
The sun came out and the whole city of Telluride was rained with white.

01:30:36.824 --> 01:30:38.645
Like everything below is white.

01:30:38.659 --> 01:30:43.020
7, 500 feet was brown and green and beautiful.

01:30:43.380 --> 01:30:46.750
And everything above that was bright white, two feet of fresh snow.

01:30:47.739 --> 01:30:49.189
It was just gorgeous.

01:30:49.199 --> 01:30:51.909
Like the most amazing inward, like front row at page and plant.

01:30:52.109 --> 01:30:52.380
Yeah.

01:30:52.609 --> 01:30:54.060
And the sun, the sun's out.

01:30:54.060 --> 01:30:55.489
You're like, this is just really, right.

01:30:55.489 --> 01:30:59.380
We're warm now for the first time in hours and hours, you know?

01:30:59.380 --> 01:31:01.760
And it's like, how did, how does this happen?

01:31:03.039 --> 01:31:04.449
Right place at the right time.

01:31:04.739 --> 01:31:05.109
Anyway.

01:31:05.220 --> 01:31:06.600
So yeah, it's a special place for us.

01:31:06.630 --> 01:31:10.970
Um, Another mountain, another cool thing about Colorado and being a lot of mountain towns.

01:31:10.989 --> 01:31:11.789
Yeah, living here.

01:31:11.789 --> 01:31:14.460
And, um, yeah, so we met.

01:31:14.460 --> 01:31:14.859
So yeah.

01:31:14.880 --> 01:31:15.840
So we had a wedding there.

01:31:15.859 --> 01:31:17.319
Non denominational wedding.

01:31:17.319 --> 01:31:18.649
Were your parents cool with that?

01:31:18.659 --> 01:31:19.069
They were.

01:31:19.130 --> 01:31:20.899
Were they rusty Catholics anyway?

01:31:21.310 --> 01:31:23.569
No, no, they were pretty full on, man.

01:31:23.640 --> 01:31:24.449
They were pretty full on.

01:31:24.449 --> 01:31:25.819
But they loved you and they loved her.

01:31:25.859 --> 01:31:27.550
So let's just call it good.

01:31:27.579 --> 01:31:31.640
And you alluded to the fact they're also happy like I was getting married at that stage.

01:31:31.640 --> 01:31:36.210
Yeah, you're like 37 was late in my life, they're like, Is this girl for real?

01:31:36.260 --> 01:31:38.310
Because this guy hasn't Is she a girl?

01:31:38.310 --> 01:31:43.720
And then they met her and they're like, How, how, how did you, how did this work out?

01:31:43.720 --> 01:31:46.069
Because, how did you get her to say yes?

01:31:46.109 --> 01:31:48.260
And I said, uh, You know, I got lucky.

01:31:48.300 --> 01:31:49.689
I, uh, she's younger too.

01:31:49.829 --> 01:31:50.460
She's younger.

01:31:50.529 --> 01:31:50.890
Yeah.

01:31:50.939 --> 01:31:55.069
People used to joke as if you're a football analogy or metaphor is the outkicks, your coverage.

01:31:55.270 --> 01:31:55.710
Yeah.

01:31:55.750 --> 01:31:55.909
Yeah.

01:31:56.069 --> 01:31:59.630
So she's, she's, uh, she's everything more than I am.

01:31:59.640 --> 01:32:02.850
Well, and you're a, you're a driven, successful.

01:32:08.369 --> 01:32:11.479
I'm the king of the backhanded compliment is what some people tell me.

01:32:12.460 --> 01:32:18.670
So faith and family and politics, you kind of dodged the prediction index.

01:32:18.939 --> 01:32:21.319
I was looking at the, uh, what have you learned?

01:32:21.340 --> 01:32:25.550
What's well, the betting, uh, yeah, what's it saying?

01:32:26.734 --> 01:32:30.755
Well, not the Vegas one, but the metadata thing or something.

01:32:30.755 --> 01:32:31.305
The political.

01:32:31.444 --> 01:32:32.345
Yeah, the, yeah.

01:32:32.765 --> 01:32:35.114
Uh, it's up to 65, 35 Trump now.

01:32:35.505 --> 01:32:37.284
65 Trump, 35 Kamala.

01:32:37.385 --> 01:32:40.715
Yeah, and it was like, Kamala was ahead, ahead, ahead.

01:32:40.765 --> 01:32:41.135
Yeah.

01:32:41.135 --> 01:32:48.199
And then they had, uh, the debate and it kind of changed a little bit and then she started going on her media blitz and it's been widening.

01:32:48.659 --> 01:32:51.390
So widening as she's going to win or he's going to win?

01:32:51.449 --> 01:32:52.170
He's going to win.

01:32:52.180 --> 01:32:52.739
He's going to win.

01:32:52.739 --> 01:32:53.069
Interesting.

01:32:53.079 --> 01:32:56.920
I think the more people see her, the more they're like, I don't know.

01:32:56.920 --> 01:32:57.850
I mean, I don't know.

01:32:57.890 --> 01:32:58.649
I don't, I don't keep up.

01:32:58.649 --> 01:33:00.699
That's what the, that's what the data suggests to me.

01:33:00.789 --> 01:33:01.130
Yeah.

01:33:01.130 --> 01:33:06.920
It's funny that I'll throw a data point back here cause I'm a, I'm a skimmer of like, Political info.

01:33:07.119 --> 01:33:07.939
Probably, I don't know.

01:33:08.010 --> 01:33:13.729
I don't know what the majority of the Well, some people are saying Elon Musk is influencing the, that gambling site.

01:33:13.899 --> 01:33:14.920
Oh, is that right?

01:33:14.920 --> 01:33:16.119
To try to swing the odds.

01:33:16.170 --> 01:33:17.970
Oh my gosh, so he's got money down on it?

01:33:18.520 --> 01:33:22.869
I, uh, saw some, um, uh, some article recently.

01:33:23.159 --> 01:33:32.020
I want to say, um, The gist of the article was about the incumbency of, the party incumbency in this case, the Democratic Party.

01:33:32.789 --> 01:33:47.225
Um, the likelihood of, uh, I think it was the last 19 presidencies have been, uh, Gone in the incumbent's way when the economy, so I was, I remember what it was, was perceived to be good.

01:33:47.255 --> 01:33:47.795
Correct.

01:33:47.824 --> 01:33:54.274
And, and it literally within, and I, I, I remember reading and almost the same number have gone the other way if the economy appears to be bad.

01:33:54.305 --> 01:33:54.755
Bingo.

01:33:54.845 --> 01:33:59.645
And because the time, which is why Kamala has been trying quite hard to not be the incumbent.

01:34:00.625 --> 01:34:02.395
Obviously I'm not Joe Biden, you know?

01:34:02.454 --> 01:34:03.295
Yeah, yeah, totally.

01:34:03.295 --> 01:34:04.585
I bet I'm somebody else.

01:34:04.675 --> 01:34:04.795
Right.

01:34:04.795 --> 01:34:10.524
Um, so this, this, uh, predictive, uh, data point was relative to the s and p.

01:34:11.289 --> 01:34:18.109
Index and in the economy, that was the indication of the data was was looking at that back to the indicator.

01:34:18.149 --> 01:34:18.439
Yeah.

01:34:18.460 --> 01:34:19.520
And so fascinating.

01:34:19.850 --> 01:34:24.500
Based on what you see, I think the, I think the S and P's up, uh, 12 percent this year.

01:34:24.579 --> 01:34:24.970
Okay.

01:34:25.020 --> 01:34:26.390
So you're saying Kamala's going to win.

01:34:27.039 --> 01:34:27.989
I'm not saying that.

01:34:28.250 --> 01:34:29.630
That's what the indicator said.

01:34:29.630 --> 01:34:30.909
And so I was guessing about it.

01:34:30.909 --> 01:34:32.550
Well, that was the indicator you mentioned though.

01:34:32.569 --> 01:34:33.720
So it was, it was a stock market.

01:34:33.720 --> 01:34:33.899
Yeah.

01:34:33.930 --> 01:34:38.279
Well, and that's the interesting thing is like with inflation, every dollar is smaller.

01:34:38.279 --> 01:34:39.800
And so is it the same?

01:34:39.939 --> 01:34:40.260
I don't know.

01:34:40.829 --> 01:34:45.520
Um, if you wanted to give a brand to your personal politics, what would it be?

01:34:45.720 --> 01:34:46.529
Oh, personal politics.

01:34:46.600 --> 01:34:49.460
I am a fiscally conservative.

01:34:49.590 --> 01:34:49.880
Okay.

01:34:49.989 --> 01:34:58.845
Uh, I am, uh, socially independent, uh, cause I'm more and much of an open thinker, like what is the right thing to do?

01:34:58.965 --> 01:35:00.664
So you're libertarian ish.

01:35:01.005 --> 01:35:01.744
I guess.

01:35:01.755 --> 01:35:02.444
But not really.

01:35:02.505 --> 01:35:08.255
Yeah, I mean I think, uh, I probably fall within what I believe in the most of the country is 65 percent of the country is independent.

01:35:08.604 --> 01:35:09.085
Yeah, yeah.

01:35:09.135 --> 01:35:11.145
And that's kind of Is it 65%?

01:35:11.145 --> 01:35:17.225
I think it is, you do the math on like 27, 29 ish in the both ends and then there's this large Wow.

01:35:17.494 --> 01:35:18.015
Registered.

01:35:18.024 --> 01:35:21.109
Isn't it crazy that there's not A third party?

01:35:21.630 --> 01:35:23.380
Middle normal party.

01:35:25.090 --> 01:35:27.060
You use the word normal, is there air quotes around that?

01:35:27.569 --> 01:35:30.720
Well, I would consider myself a normie, for the most part.

01:35:31.029 --> 01:35:33.274
You know, um, I don't know.

01:35:33.414 --> 01:35:44.265
I, listen, I, the reason why I say that is, um, I Well and the interesting thing is you can't really tell that, like, Kamala's been taking some of Donald Trump's ideas.

01:35:44.425 --> 01:35:44.704
Sure.

01:35:44.725 --> 01:35:47.345
So the, the policy things aren't that far apart.

01:35:47.954 --> 01:35:52.614
I mean I don't think any, if you really think about the presidency over many, many decades.

01:35:52.685 --> 01:35:53.175
Yeah.

01:35:53.694 --> 01:35:56.524
You, you, you position yourself.

01:35:56.704 --> 01:36:02.914
Uh, as a can't seems like you position yourself as a candidate for a party to get the base, but you only win if you get the middle.

01:36:03.015 --> 01:36:03.515
Yeah.

01:36:03.585 --> 01:36:03.875
Yeah.

01:36:03.875 --> 01:36:04.755
That's, I think proof.

01:36:04.904 --> 01:36:05.725
So we'll see.

01:36:05.744 --> 01:36:12.814
Well, and, and Kamala has got all the ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies.

01:36:12.814 --> 01:36:14.725
Um, so that could be a big factor.

01:36:14.765 --> 01:36:23.784
I mean, she's getting like 80 percent of the single ladies that, and I think the younger, the next generation is is clearly in favor and the black men are probably going to.

01:36:24.430 --> 01:36:28.079
Bring Tump into office, in my opinion, is that they're turning hard.

01:36:28.109 --> 01:36:28.600
Oh yeah.

01:36:28.600 --> 01:36:28.909
Okay.

01:36:30.810 --> 01:36:37.460
I mean, yeah, it might be, it might be 40%, 35, like the polls say 21%.

01:36:38.210 --> 01:36:38.810
Bullshit.

01:36:39.119 --> 01:36:43.000
I'm going to say 30 percent plus of black men will vote for Trump.

01:36:43.050 --> 01:36:43.989
35 maybe.

01:36:44.220 --> 01:36:44.649
Wow.

01:36:44.670 --> 01:36:47.439
Which would be like up from 8%.

01:36:49.095 --> 01:36:49.534
Yeah.

01:36:49.534 --> 01:36:50.185
A couple of elections ago.

01:36:50.255 --> 01:36:52.414
I mean, I think that's what's so unique about politics.

01:36:52.414 --> 01:36:56.534
I mean, it's, um, it's a lesson in like, uh, marketing.

01:36:56.824 --> 01:36:57.305
Totally.

01:36:57.414 --> 01:36:57.805
A hundred percent.

01:36:58.005 --> 01:36:59.545
That message platform strategy.

01:36:59.545 --> 01:37:00.194
Well, and forgivable loans.

01:37:00.265 --> 01:37:03.225
You know, that depends on how many people heard about the forgivable loans.

01:37:03.314 --> 01:37:03.994
Oh, man.

01:37:04.314 --> 01:37:04.774
Anyway.

01:37:05.055 --> 01:37:05.524
Um.

01:37:06.375 --> 01:37:08.694
I think we're through with the politics enough.

01:37:08.744 --> 01:37:09.444
Are you comfortable?

01:37:09.475 --> 01:37:10.255
You want anything else?

01:37:10.265 --> 01:37:15.875
No, I mean, I think I will say this, um, and I think this will come out after the election, by the way.

01:37:15.875 --> 01:37:16.664
So, Oh yeah.

01:37:16.664 --> 01:37:16.864
Yeah.

01:37:16.864 --> 01:37:18.475
So as far as who wins, I have no idea.

01:37:19.154 --> 01:37:20.104
Your predictive forces.

01:37:20.114 --> 01:37:20.534
Yeah.

01:37:20.694 --> 01:37:25.854
But what I will say, and this is hopefully a decent jumping off point to get you to think about politics.

01:37:26.635 --> 01:37:28.744
I've been lucky enough to travel outside of this country.

01:37:28.744 --> 01:37:32.425
It sounds like you have to, uh, enough times to appreciate.

01:37:32.770 --> 01:37:44.649
What I think is one of the more challenging things within our country is the perspective of, while it's not perfect here, there are a lot of places that I've been able to travel to.

01:37:44.880 --> 01:37:45.149
Totally.

01:37:45.220 --> 01:37:48.800
Asia and Japan and Europe, you know.

01:37:48.810 --> 01:37:49.229
Yeah, yeah.

01:37:49.300 --> 01:37:52.244
And you realize, you're like, It's not that bad.

01:37:52.534 --> 01:37:53.725
Oh yeah, no, it's real nice.

01:37:54.194 --> 01:38:01.994
We have our issues, but it's still a first world, top echelon, thank gosh we were born here, individuals.

01:38:02.005 --> 01:38:07.954
Well, when you were talking about the job description stuff, I was thinking to myself, uh, Jenny Arndt is our mayor here in town.

01:38:08.395 --> 01:38:12.675
And she was kind of describing her job a little bit to me a couple of years ago now.

01:38:13.085 --> 01:38:32.465
And she's like, it's, You know, you're really just part of the city council, but you're really kind of the figurehead and the face of Fort Collins when anybody wants to come visit, when you've got dignitaries of some sort or people to host or things like that and kind of, and that's maybe more like the role of the president than we give it credit for.

01:38:32.524 --> 01:38:33.045
I think so.

01:38:33.045 --> 01:38:34.595
I mean, I don't know.

01:38:34.595 --> 01:38:35.074
I don't have it.

01:38:35.324 --> 01:38:36.095
I'm not really.

01:38:36.625 --> 01:38:41.215
Steve, well, and you can launch nuclear weapons that, yeah, that, that button you have to push.

01:38:41.534 --> 01:38:42.795
That's what the movie saying Hollywood.

01:38:43.265 --> 01:38:44.135
Well, I assume so.

01:38:44.175 --> 01:38:44.534
I don't know.

01:38:44.604 --> 01:38:54.994
I mean, there is a lock that our earliest, um, uh, or at least forefathers created, uh, three branches of the economy or of the political system government.

01:38:55.274 --> 01:39:01.220
So that itself gives you a little confidence that That's why I joke about who's in office.

01:39:01.250 --> 01:39:02.890
If they try too much, they'll get cock blocked.

01:39:02.890 --> 01:39:03.989
Yeah.

01:39:03.989 --> 01:39:04.310
Effectively.

01:39:04.350 --> 01:39:04.600
Yeah.

01:39:04.750 --> 01:39:08.189
And then you, you, you realize like, I mean, that's a theory anyway.

01:39:08.220 --> 01:39:09.020
They figured it out.

01:39:09.069 --> 01:39:11.789
There's a reason why it's a, it's a, it's a tripod.

01:39:12.270 --> 01:39:13.689
Um, last question.

01:39:13.689 --> 01:39:14.069
Yes, sir.

01:39:14.130 --> 01:39:18.770
Your loco experience, the craziest experience that you're willing to share with our listeners?

01:39:18.770 --> 01:39:19.090
Yeah.

01:39:19.090 --> 01:39:20.659
You asked me to think about that.

01:39:20.659 --> 01:39:22.229
I'm like, gosh, I wish I had like that.

01:39:22.840 --> 01:39:23.289
Awesome.

01:39:23.369 --> 01:39:27.819
I mean that meeting the girl you were supposed to be introduced to a year before is a little crazy.

01:39:27.970 --> 01:39:28.510
It was.

01:39:28.510 --> 01:39:30.239
It was, it was, it was life changing.

01:39:30.539 --> 01:39:31.430
You know, it should have been.

01:39:31.439 --> 01:39:32.680
Changed her trajectory for sure.

01:39:32.689 --> 01:39:33.430
Totally did.

01:39:33.430 --> 01:39:41.439
And, and, uh, she'd be, uh, hopefully blushing that, that is today probably the thing that's uh, the most amazing part of my life.

01:39:41.439 --> 01:39:45.359
I'm blessed and lucky enough to have a special relationship with my wife.

01:39:45.409 --> 01:39:45.600
Yeah.

01:39:45.609 --> 01:39:47.319
Um, we see the world.

01:39:47.350 --> 01:39:49.229
No, it sounds like your face was probably changed.

01:39:50.045 --> 01:39:51.324
Through that in some ways, too.

01:39:51.335 --> 01:39:55.015
Had you been active in any kind of church environment after college?

01:39:55.024 --> 01:40:02.074
Maybe not as much as, yeah, to your point, maybe not as much as I had been after and just what brought us together and believing in a higher power.

01:40:02.074 --> 01:40:05.664
I'm like, hey, that was a pretty chance to show up at the same time.

01:40:06.164 --> 01:40:07.784
So yeah, let's, let's end on that.

01:40:07.795 --> 01:40:12.149
There's uh, That's probably the thing that's the most beautiful in my life as it is now and hopefully forever.

01:40:12.170 --> 01:40:16.359
Anika, you're his crazy experience, still going after 10 years.

01:40:16.420 --> 01:40:16.989
That's right.

01:40:17.000 --> 01:40:17.880
How lucky is that?

01:40:18.180 --> 01:40:19.140
Is it, did I say that right?

01:40:19.140 --> 01:40:19.140
Anika?

01:40:19.140 --> 01:40:19.140
Anika.

01:40:19.140 --> 01:40:20.890
Anika, I'm sorry.

01:40:20.930 --> 01:40:23.770
But there is one of those golfers that keeps, it's a similar type of name.

01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:25.409
How people pronounce that name.

01:40:25.460 --> 01:40:26.140
Can you believe that?

01:40:26.850 --> 01:40:27.550
The rudeness.

01:40:28.930 --> 01:40:29.590
Brian, thanks.

01:40:29.590 --> 01:40:30.289
It's been a lot of fun.

01:40:30.310 --> 01:40:31.010
Kurt, thanks man.

01:40:31.010 --> 01:40:31.670
It was awesome.

01:40:31.720 --> 01:40:32.189
Godspeed.

01:40:32.250 --> 01:40:32.930
Yeah, appreciate it.