EXPERIENCE 131 | Hope Hartmann, Kat Hart, and Lisa Hudson - Unstoppable Women on a Mission for Business Growth & Success!

hope Hartman. Cat Hart and Lisa Hudson are the leading ladies, respectively at the Larimer Small Business Development Center, Loveland Business Development Center, and East Colorado Small Business Development Center. These regional s BDCs in cooperation with other partners will bring us the Unstoppable Women's Conference on October 10th, 2023. Hope has been on the podcast previously, episode 93 so this episode was particularly focused on Katt and Lisa's journeys. In addition to all the ladies sharing more about the conference and their respective Ss, B D, C areas and manner of service, Kat's parents served in the nonprofit community in Weld County, and her mom was a visible and notable Hispanic women's leader. She had many interests but was especially passionate and involved with cultural dance. She started with the Larimer S B D C as an intern, but soon joined the team full-time, but later moved outta state a short season later. Katt was recruited to the Loveland b d c role by the departing director, a role she is now served for four years. Likewise. Lisa came to the East Colorado SS B D C as an intern, but grew quickly in the role and responsibilities and spent years as the associate director before taking on the lead role. She's been with the organization for 13 years now and led the group for seven. She grew up in an entrepreneurial family and the joys and challenges of small business continue to fuel her journey. The spirit of community and collaboration in the room was almost overwhelming during this conversation. And you'll love getting to better know these leading ladies. So please join me for this latest episode and if you're a woman in business or no one, make sure to share this episode and attend the Unstoppable Women's Conference on October 10th. Welcome back to the Local Experience Podcast. My guests today are Hope Hartman, Lisa Hudson and Kat Hart, uh, respectively the executive directors of the three Northern Colorado, uh, small business development centers in Fort Collins for Hope and Weld County, but also eastward, uh, east Colorado. Is that right? SS P D C for, uh, Lisa, and then Loveland Business Development Center for Kat. So, welcome ladies. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Um, and today's conversation, uh, partly arose because we're gonna talk a little bit about the Unstoppable Women's Conference coming up. Uh, what's the date on that? October 10th. October 10th. 10 10. 10. 10. I like it. Uh, 10 ten's like all the, all the great ladies. You know, 10 on a 10 point scale as far as achievement. Um, I like that. We should've used that. Yeah, there's some branding there. So, um, why don't we, uh, like, why don't I let you start Katt, uh, just outline this conference for me just a bit. Yeah, so it is a great conference. It's been going on for seven years. We had a bit of a hiatus, I think this is actually officially six years that it's been going on, but the first one was seven years ago. Yeah, I think it was a little bit more than seven years. Oh, gotcha. But, you know, we had that whole fun hiatus, but what what it's really focused on is empowering small, uh, business owners, specifically women business owners, because there are certain challenges that women business owners face that maybe, um, male, their male counterparts don't necessarily face. And also some resources that we can provide that are really specific to women business owners. Yeah. Um, it's great because it's a mix of business education and empowerment. Yeah. So that's a little bit different than some of the other trainings and things that we offer through our centers on a regular basis. Are men invited? Yes. Good. We're gonna have a booth, so I'm gonna be there at least some. So, um, and I just had Jen Henderson on the podcast and I understand she was the keynote just last year. And we talked a fair bit really about her challenges and, and around raising capital and just kind of the, the scarcity of capital and the different mindset. Um, is that part of this conference as well, are you looking, is it part of, you know, that real high growth scale up thing or is that not necessarily. I think there's components of that. So there's always some topic around funding or, um, maybe how you can go for bigger dollars, even if it were with government contracts. So it might not necessarily be about angel or venture capital. There's other organizations that really are more focused on that, but there's always a little elements across the spectrum. And also the keynote this year is another high growth. Yeah. Um, I'm looking forward to meeting her. The, the groovy. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And Lisa, um, can you outline, kind of tell me, is it a whole day thing and, and kind of give me a, give the listeners a perspective of what they would find if they, if they come to this conference? Yeah. So it's definitely an all day event. Um, this conference is so special to me and I know to all the ladies here in the room, um, because I really feel like the theme that we chose this year, educate, encourage, and empower, takes this to a new level. And, um, you spend an entire day with all of these. Amazing. Women who own businesses are part of businesses are thinking about starting a business and and that's what they get to do. They get to learn through education, they get to encourage others who are sitting aside them and really just feel that empowerment. I mean, the energy. Every year. I'm just so surprised and I, I say this all the time, but I just get goosebumps talking about it. I can tell it's so much fun. Um, high energy and it's just a great day. Um, so is it like kind of the speakers and things, is it some of your. Other S B D C resources, it's, and they're putting together special workshops or things like that. Is it talks, is it, yeah. It's all the things. And this year is, is pretty special. So, um, in the past we've hand selected our speakers and this year we did a call for presenters and oh my goodness, what a response we had. Yeah. We had, um, 16 presenter slot slots open, and we ended up with over 70 submissions. Whoa. Uh, and, and mo more than half of those were people that have never presented for an S B D C before. Wow. Uh, which is fantastic. Which shows us that we're, we're kind of tapping talent that we don't normally get. Um, or we don't, you know, it's not normally in our circles, so, yeah. Yeah. That's, that's really exciting too. That's, and there, there're people that we know in the community, but maybe have never presented for us. Yeah.'cause we just didn't have the space to do a full class. Well, one of the cool things about Northern Colorado here is it's a place where people choose to live. And so there's a lot of like national level consultants and topical experts that choose to live here and relish the idea of coming to someplace local instead of flying off to Virginia or Atlanta or wherever they're doing their coaching or seminar work or keynotes or things like that. Hope, um, this is your second time then taking part in this event, right? Yeah. Because you're, you're the newbie on the team here. I am the newbie and I actually attended this as a small business owner back in 2013 or 14, I can't remember. And at the time it was already like the third annual or the second annual, and I was like, I didn't even know about the first one. And that's when I found out about it and it was such an impressive day. I actually kept the program. I still have that program. Cool. It's almost a decade old. So you three ladies have probably traveled much different paths, uh, toward leadership of, of your respective organizations. I've. Okay. I met you when you were an intern, if I recall. Yep. Um, when was that? Do you remember? Uh, let's see. So that would've been about 20, I think I started with Larimer in 2012. Okay. Or 2013. Yeah. Um, and I, I made that whole transition from being a student employee with them to being a full-time admin and then taking on a lot of their marketing stuff. Life took me to Oregon for a couple of years and I came back and this. And then Loveland was looking for a director for their program. Yeah. So as I started reaching out to my local contacts again to look for something local, they were like, Hey, you should step into this role. And I was like, wow. Okay. Yeah. That's awesome. Remind me the name of the gal that ran it for so many years before, uh, Maryanne. Huffines. Maryanne, yeah. Yes, she is fantastic. She was fantastic. Uh, she flirted with me when she started thinking about retirement. At, at one point I was like, no, I know I'm busy and I don't really, I'm not in Loveland. And, but, uh, I was very. But honored honestly to, to be considered in that notion. Um, and Lisa, where did you come from? Uh, in the East Colorado. S B D C. Were you,'cause you were su you're pretty young now by my standards too. But you were super young when I first met you. Oh my gosh. Thank you so much. Um, so I've been with the East Co S B D C for 13 years actually. Wow. I know, right? Um, but it's, it's been so great. I, um, a local gal. I went to school at the, um, university of Northern Colorado. Mm-hmm. Montford College of Business Go Bears. Yeah. Um, took a class called Small Business Counseling, which my predecessor actually taught. Um, and that's how I got connected to the S B D C and, uh, started as a marketing consultant and have just. You know, stayed with the program. I love S B C, obviously, so what did you say? 13 years? 13 years, yeah. Oh my goodness. I know. So it's really all you've known in your career in some ways. Yeah. And what was your predecessor's name? Dick Pickett. Yes. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah, he's still around. You can still see him occasionally. And, um, great man. He's been, um, a wonderful mentor for me in my professional life and, um, been really great to, you know, grow under his wing and the SS B d C role and really learn from him. And now I'm executive director for the center and we've grown, so. And how long has that been, um, that you've been the director? Um, since 2017. Okay. Mm-hmm. Oh, so you're, you're a grizzled veteran in the role now. Yeah. Even compared to either of these ladies, right? Yeah, because Kat, when did you come into that role at Loveland? Uh, 2019. 19. Late 2019. Yeah. Okay. Oh, so there was long stable period before things had to change in that space. Yes. So, um, I wanna shift back to the conference just a little bit and tell me like, Who are the ideal people that if they're hearing this, they should make sure they either attend or, or tell their friends about this conference? Is it all across Northern Colorado that are welcome it? Yes, and uh, you know, I think one of our targets are those people who identify with being solopreneurs. And the reason I say it's so important for them is this journey is challenging and it can be isolating and it's so important for all entrepreneurs, but some of our women entrepreneurs are also moms and all this stuff. Sure. To just realize they really aren't alone. There's other people follow a similar path and it can make all the difference in the world. So that's a part of our event as well. There are multiple opportunities to network and that that's a big part of just making those connections with other women, making space for it. Yeah. Um, Lisa, what, what else would you add to. That, like, is it like, do you want big business owners too, that are ladies, uh, to attend? Just, just help celebrate and inspire these solopreneurs? Yeah. I mean, we're inviting all, all of the business, all the ladies, all the ladies can get all the single ladies, just all the, all the single ladies, all the married ladies. I mean, whatever you, you identify as, you know, although I identify as ladies, um, but it, but you have to use a men's room, you know, we'll see. We'll talk about that later. Um, but yeah, we we're encouraging everyone to come. It's a great way to connect and, and learn from one another. Yeah. You know, so you never know what kind of connections you might make personally or professionally. And this is at the aims, uh, community college. What's the name of that fancy building again? The Welcome Center. Yeah. Mm-hmm. That is an amazing facility and I'm, I'm glad it's there, frankly. I think it's a, for this kind of event, it's, it's well parked. It's gigantic. Uh, is it one big space or do you have a lot of breakout room opportunities and things like that? It is a very, very flexible space. I, I absolutely love the welcome center as a, as an event venue for something like this, because there are several breakout rooms. Every room has wonderful technology and sound built into it. Um, and, and there it's just a really, Flexible space. Yeah. Um, because they've got a large ballroom upstairs that can be separated out and then they've got the auditorium with the sky boxes that can also be separated out. Um, so it allows us to be able to run multiple sessions throughout the day and have people not feel like they're on top of each other. Yeah. Um, and it's also pretty easy to navigate, especially now that it's kind of been up and running for another year and people are getting more familiar with the space.'cause several other area conferences are holding their events at this space because it's so fantastic. Yeah. They've done a great job in getting out there in the community and I suspect, uh, as a longtime banker that they're also giving better rates than some places that are proud because they just need more people to know about it and know how awesome it is. And then they'll raise their rates once you guys get cozy there. And the other thing I'd like to add too, you know, when we were touring spaces last year with the mindset of, you know, we wanna hold this conference in a space that'll be familiar each year, is, will this space allow for growth in the conference? It definitely does. Yeah. So how many people do you anticipate? How many people, um, could come? Mm-hmm. So, uh, we had 304 last year. We, to put a little stretch goal, let's get at least three 50, but I'm always like, why don't we have 500? Yeah. I mean, I want this to grow and I think that would be a great problem to have. So we got room for you and it could accommodate it for sure. You could do 800 there if you could grow with a crowd eventually, kind of thing. Yes. So I wanna do a little contrast on the, the different BDCs, uh, in the region if we could. Um, and, and Lisa, you're probably yours, is the most different from what I'm most familiar with here at the Lerer County. Can you, uh, give a sketch out of how. Business owners in East Colorado access your services? Yeah, so, um, the East Coast, b d C, we are a very large geographic center. Um, we cover 20 counties. Mm. Um, yeah. Compared to Larimer County. Yeah. Um, which is a big county but not 20. Yeah. We're about 30,000 square miles. Okay. Um, so we go everywhere from Julesburg to Trinidad. That's, if you can imagine a map Wow. From the top of the state down to the bottom of the state. Oh, I didn't realize, I thought it was like north of I 70 and whatever used to be. Oh, wow. Yeah. Well, somebody needs to do something about that. That's too big of a space, but whatever. As long as they pay you the big bucks, I guess you can drive down there once in a while. I love what I do. I'll say that. Um, so what we have done at East Coast is we've got two full-time offices since we do have such a large territory to cover. One in Greeley at the month College of Business, and then one down in Otero County. And, um, where's that? It's, if you know where La Junta is, it's near there. Sure. Yeah. Okay. Yep. Um, and so we've opened satellite offices throughout our area so that way people wouldn't have to drive more than 30 minutes to see a consultant in person if they like. But you know, that small thing that we had the pandemic, it did change the way we offer our services. Mm-hmm. Um, so we do a lot of virtual stuff. Sure. Um, and we continue to do that, save that gas, especially when it's 50 miles or whatever. Right. Yeah. Um, so that's really what we offer. Um, we've got satellite locations all through the territory for those who wanna meet in person, but I see most of our clients still looking for that virtual service. And are they meeting with contractors like, yeah. Here. Mm-hmm. Yep. So I've got contract consultants serving the, the whole territory. So these are like business veterans mm-hmm. That want to give back in some respects, and they probably get paid a stipend for it or whatever, but it's not a full-time hustle for most of them. Correct. Yep. Fair enough. Um, and how many in total then? Um, we've got about 25 and, uh, still growing, looking to add more. Okay. So if you're out in East Colorado and you've got business experience and you wanna give back to small business owners, give me a call, huh? Right. Awesome. Yeah, you can look her up. She's on LinkedIn. Yeah. You have a website just for their place. Yeah. Um, and then, then you have some paid staff as well, right? Yeah. That occupy your offices mm-hmm. And stuff. Mm-hmm. So I've got two full-time, um, people down in Southeast Colorado. Okay. Um, an associate director and an administrative specialist. And then up north we've um, got six positions. I'll say. I, I do have some open positions right now. Um, but yeah, we have some full-time staff that's also supporting our whole territory. Right. And they help the contractors get their resources and different things. And I'm assuming reporting is a big deal all big time everybody, that kind of thing? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And, um, Hope we kind of talked about Larimer County quite a bit. Um, and so I think I'll just shift over to Kat and say, now differentiate.'cause Loveland's got its own kind of thing going, but it works closely with Larimer County. And tell me about that a little bit. So I am, I am an unofficial SS B D C, but I'm, I also, I have this. This really neat thing that I get to do, I get to like, um, straddle like the chamber world along with the business development centers. Um, so I am actually hosted by the Loveland Chamber of Commerce and my funding comes through the le the city of Loveland primarily. Um, but I partner very closely with the Larimer B D C because I'm a staff of one. Yeah. Whereas Lisa's got this gigantic territory of 30,000 square miles. Right. I only serve the city of Loveland. Like the city limits basically. Almost. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And I kinda dabble a little bit into Johnstown and Berkeley'cause it makes sense because some of those businesses are so close to Loveland. Sure. Um, but I do offer the same services in terms of the consulting and the classes and things like that. Um, I actually help a lot of times with sourcing new consultants for the Larimer S B D C. So Sure. When I meet people out in the community that are like, Hey, I wanna give back to our business owners, I'm like, okay, let's talk about what your experience is and where it might be appropriate for you to give back. Yeah. Um, so I'm able to get. Both, um, the support from Larimer S B D C for our clients, as well as some of the things that the Chamber offers in terms of helping our businesses plug into, um, some of the advocacy and things like that, that Chambers do, that business that the s BDCs don't do. Right. Right. Okay. So in, in some ways it's like a partnership between the Chamber and the city more than it is like front Range Community College and the B D C network. So I can speak a little of that. So there's actually an agreement between the Larimer S B D C and the Loveland Chamber of Commerce. Yeah. In regards to that. There are, not only is Cat there, but there are consultants there. Yeah. That can meet with Loveland business owners. And do those consultants get paid by Front Range Community College then? Kind of by Larama. I see. So you're in some ways Katt, you're there to make sure that Loveland. Gets enough attention. Exactly. Uh, and the city finds that worth its while or whatever in the chamber, of course. And things, but then it still accesses this broader network and classes are done cooperatively and things like that. Exactly. Okay. When Larimer needs someone to step in and, you know, help with a class, often I can step in and help teach that. Um, or if they need a space in Loveland to host something, uh, I can help get'em plugged into that too. Gotcha. So it's, it's a really great partnership that we've got that That's great. I didn't really realize quite the dynamic there. Yeah. And all the consultants, then the Franklin Taggarts and things like that, even people I associate more with Loveland, they're all Larimer County, S B D C people. And I, yeah, I was gonna speak to that. I think also with, with the pandemic, it really changed things because in the past everything was in person. So there were physical consulting offices, classes there. The, the consultants in Loveland showed up for the business owners in Loveland. Well, now it's like everybody's serving everyone. So Loveland business owners can tap into any. Broader. It doesn't matter if they're on ES Park, a broader number too. Yeah. And I, I think it's a beautiful position to be in. Yeah. Yeah. Very cool. Um, and again, same, your client demographic ranges from that. Wish I had a business all the way up to, Hey, I've been in business for 10 years and we executed our business plan and now I need to write a new one. Yeah. Everything from, I am thinking about starting a business to, uh, for solopreneurs, for people who are looking to end up hiring employees, um, growing site selection, um, even exiting the business successfully because that can be part of the services that we offer is sometimes people wanna exit their business for a number of reasons. Whether they wanna sell their business to someone else or Yeah. They just wanna shut it down because Yeah. Sometimes exiting unsuccessfully is an important thing to do as well. Yeah, yeah. You know, lick your wounds and try again. I'm a proud owner of, uh, three failed enterprises before local think tank started growing finally. So, uh, there's actually a peer advisory group. That you have to have failed three times, uh, before you can become a member. But I haven't been approached yet. Um, so this, this podcast, a lot of the format is a get to know, uh, as well. And we, we got to know hope pretty extensively in, in episode 89 or 90 or something last fall. And so I'm gonna dive into, uh, you ladies, Lisa and, and Kat, and get more of your like life journey, uh, and you know, even trying to unfold that passion for, for this work and where did that come from and things like that. So, who wants to go first? Have a go first. Sure. We're all gonna jump in the time machine together. There's gonna be like a clown car time machine. I hope you have some extra special effects for that because that's an awesome, um, yeah, we'll lay, we'll dub some good stuff in there. So, uh, first grade. Where are you at, Lisa? Um, well, first grade, so I'm a local gal, you know, just Weld County or whatever, all the way. Yeah. I, I grew up in small town, LaSalle, Colorado. Okay. Yep. And, uh, grew up here. I love Northern Colorado. Um, my dad, he was actually an entrepreneur himself. Okay. He had his own, um, contracting business. Okay. Um, building houses here in northern Colorado. Okay. So, you know, in that industry it's very, um, economy dependent. Sure. And so, you know, I saw the highs and I saw the lows and, you know, so I, I really relate to these small business owners, um, especially with the times that we're in and what they may be seeing coming down the road. And Yeah. Um, I can, I can relate to that. Was your dad's business a uh, Like, was he a solopreneur general contractor pretty much, or did he have a Yeah, he, he had a partner, but, um, grew the business. Um, he didn't end up really hiring employees. He, yeah, he was, well, that's a perfectionist as a builder. And, um, liked, liked it, built a certain way and, um, beautiful craft. And he had his craft contractors that he. Mm-hmm. Cultivated over a long time and all that. Yeah. Yeah. That's a very interesting, and sometimes there's a whole year when you don't sell nothing hardly. Mm-hmm. Or nobody wants to hire you to build their thing. Was he doing specs? And, uh, as you know, for, for people, yeah. So he did a lot of local work. He did some custom work. Um, We'll drive through Greeley and be like, oh, I built that house. I built that house. That's, and tell me about your, the rest of your family. Did you have brothers, sisters? I got a sister. Um, my mom and my sister both went into the medical field. They're, um, okay. You know, nurse practitioners and, um, I am not into medical, so giving people shots or if I see that I'm like, oh God. Oh no. So falling in my dad's footsteps a little bit more in the business side. I don't like to see red ink, but I like to see red blood even worse. Yeah, right. So, um, I'm imagining a very, uh, uh, high achieving young lady going off and through elementary school, mostly as sports, all that. Yeah. Um, very involved student. Um, I. Don't know that there was a club I wasn't a part of. I was that kid. Yeah. Um, I, I just have always really liked getting involved and, um, doing, you know, all the different things. I think the only group that I wasn't part of was, uh, the Future Farmers of America. Yeah. Blue Cordy was not in my, my closet. You were a, you were a cosmopolitan, uh, lasal girl in some ways. Well, I suppose if, if there is one such a thing, um, I'm gonna shift over to, to Kat's first grade experience. Uh, and we'll kind of bounce back and forth a little bit on the timeline. Oh man. Okay. So I grew up in Greeley, so I'm also local. Yeah. You know, I spent the vast majority of my life in, in northern Colorado. Um, so growing up my, my parents both worked in nonprofits. Oh, wow. Um, so that really gave me a different sense of what it means to serve your community. Yeah. Because that also means they didn't make a whole lot of money. Right. Because nonprofits, you don't make a whole lot of money. Um, but you end up getting a whole lot in your heart. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so a lot of social capital. Yeah, I saw that example. My dad was an entrepreneur for a while. He had his own psychotherapy practice. Um, again, his heart was too big, so didn't, he wasn't successful with it, unfortunately, you know, ultimately. But, um, my mom worked for Catholic Charities for 20 some odd years, I think. And my dad, he was a financial counselor for a non-profit, so, so I, I saw how much they gave. Yeah. Um, and that's kind of one of the things that was always around me. Yeah. And on top of working for a nonprofit, my mom, um, helped found a group called Hispanic Women of Well County. Oh. Um, they are all about em empowering and educating Hispanic women into leadership roles. That's awesome. Uh, and helping them with professional development. So all of this stuff that my career has built to really ties to a lot of that. Um, now I just meant. Caco the other day from the Montford College is mm-hmm. She is. But she was involved with another organization as well for Hispanic leadership kind of elements. Is it the same one? I don't know that it's the same one, I think.'cause there's also, um, women of color, there's a lot of different groups. Gotcha. And my parents were involved with a lot of those. Yeah. And, and on top of them being so involved in the community, um, I was also the kid that I was in every club too. Yeah. I mean, I was in, I was in Deca, I was in lulac. I danced, I did theater, I did orchestra, like all of those things. So yeah. Very similar to Lisa in that respect. Did you have, uh, siblings as well? I. Yep. I have three older brothers and an older sister. Wow. So I'm the youngest of five. You have a baby. So, yeah. And what was that dynamic like for you? Well, we're really spread out in age. Oh. So, um, like my oldest sibling is 13 years older than me. Wow. So, um, it really, it was an interesting family dynamic because, you know, especially my two oldest brothers, they ended up doing a lot of, you know, taking care of me and stuff like that. Yeah. And, um, so their influence on me really is pretty strong too. Yeah. I, I love music and I love tech because of my two oldest brothers. Oh, cool. Yeah. That's a great, uh, advantage. Yeah. Um, This is a bit of a personal question, but mm-hmm. Uh, are both of your parents Hispanic? No, actually, um, my dad is, is Caucasian. Yeah. And my mom is Hispanic, so I, I kind of straddled that line and growing up in a town like Greeley, where it is so racially split Yeah. Um, was a really interesting dynamic for me as a kid. And when I say I did dance, a lot of people will default to like doing tap or jazz. No, I did ballet folklorico for 25 years. Wow. Wow. Um, and I actually, as an adult, I ran my own group. I got into sewing. That's cool. I got into entrepreneurship because of dancing. Yeah. Um, because of the sewing and everything that, that led me to. So, well, I think that's, to me, that's really inspiring because I think for, for the most part, I think the, you know, the white bread communities of Fort Collins and Greeley and Loveland. Want to invite Hispanics to be more integrated and a part of it. And, you know, you setting that example and, uh, just frankly the opportunity of having, uh, you know, a a a, a white dad and a Hispanic or a Caucasian dad and a Hispanic, like, gave you that outlook. And I'm sure he was very encouraging of your mom to start those organizations and really raised that voice. Yeah. And he was actually, he was part of the farm workers movement back in the sixties in the area and stuff like that. So, I mean he was very, very supportive of that. And it's really interesting too,'cause you brought up the family dynamic thing and, um, we're a Brady Bunch family. Mm-hmm. So my parents both had children before they got married to each other. So I've got siblings that are full Hispanic and I've got siblings that are full white. Yeah. And I've got some that are half, half like me. Yeah. Yeah. So it was interesting, especially as a kid trying to figure out what that, what that looked like. And, um, how would you describe, like, did you feel like. Discrimination in any capacity in your school activities and all the decas and the clubs and things like that sometimes. But, you know, it's, it's one of those things where when, when you kind of float between the two different worlds Yeah. You feel things from different sides. Yeah. Um, and there are times that people will say things on either side that they don't realize that they're talking about the other side of me. Yeah. The other side of my family. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, and especially because I do have a white last name and, you know, things like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It can, it can be, it can be interesting and it challenging and when I was younger, um, I really didn't understand. The differences until I was in early elementary, probably about first grade when other kids started pointing out to me, Hmm. That I had one brother that was brown and one brother with blonde hair and like, interesting. That came from outside. It never came from my family. And when I talk about my brothers and my siblings, uh, I don't call them my step-siblings or my half siblings. Like we are brothers and sisters. Yeah. Yeah. That's all that, that's all that matters there. So I had a, I'm trying to remember, one of my, uh, guests, Beckys also actually, uh, when her son married somebody, that person is her daughter now. Mm-hmm. From their perspective and, and kind of the same, you know, once that union is merged, then it's, you're my brother. Yeah. Yeah. Um, Lisa, tell me about, uh, like high school. Were you, you were still in all the things. Were you in athletics as well? Yeah, I was definitely, um, in all of the things and, um, into athletics. So I played volleyball and basketball and I ran track and, um, you a sprinter or longer, long distance? Well, I ran the 400 hurdles in the eight hundreds, so Oh, wow. Whatever you wanna call that. No, that's the midrange, I suppose. Yeah. Um, and, and tall enough to jump over the hurdles, which isn't always the case. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, so, you know, I, I stayed active all through, um, you know, my education even going into university. Yeah. And that was just straight to U N C. Mm-hmm. Hometown School. Hometown school, go Bears. Um, and I ran track for the university as well. Oh, really? Mm-hmm. Okay. Um, and then, What was your, what was your degree and did you start where you finished? I did, yeah. Um, so I went for, uh, a business degree right away. Mm-hmm. Um, with an emphasis in marketing and I think I was one of those rare marketing students though, that really embraced accounting. Hmm. Um, you know, so most of my electives were in accounting and I just really enjoyed the balance of accounting. But the creativity and marketing, well, I mean, creating revenue and counting it Right. Are two pretty essential functions in business for sure. Yeah. Um, how about you Katt? What was your high school experience like? Oh, high school. I was already starting my entrepreneurship journey. Oh. I was, I worked at, I actually got a job at State Farm, um, through their high school pro co-op program. Oh, cool. Um, while I was in high school and then doing theater, orchestra, all of those things. I was never an athlete. I am, I'm very graceful when ballet, when it comes to dancing, ballet, ballet as an athlete. Yeah. I was wearing 20 pound dresses in a hundred degree heat and dancing, you know, so I mean, that's as about as athletic as I can get. Um, but I started making dresses for the other, um, oh. The other families and stuff that couldn't afford, you know, dresses. So they'd pay for the materials and I'd make'em for'em. And then I started start, you know, charging for'em, but I didn't go straight to college. Oh. Um, there were some family dynamics that I just, I didn't feel like college was right for me at the time. Mm-hmm. So I was actually a non-traditional student. So you met me when I was probably about, 28 or so. Oh really? Uh, yeah. You're much older than I had you pegged. Right. Um, but I was a non-traditional student, so I actually had gotten to the point where I had gone through several different kinds of service jobs, call centers, all of that kind of stuff that people do in their early twenties Sure. When they kind of don't know where they're going. Right. Restaurants here and there. Um, yeah. And, and I really wanted to be an entrepreneur. I really wanted to use my sewing and, and create some kind of a business. And I was like, I need to know something. So I went to Front Range Community College and I was going for a certificate. I was gonna take three classes. That was gonna be it. And then after, you know, a couple of classes, I was like, no, I think I need an associate's degree. And then I was like, well, if I'm gonna do that, I may as well do student employment. That led me to S B D C. And then as I'm doing my associates, they're like, Hey, you can do this three plus one with Front Range Community College and Regis University and get your bachelor's degree. Nice. And I was like, Oh, I should do that. Why not? And the whole time I was working at Larimer, S P D C, so it was this really interesting flow into, into where I've landed now. Uh, and I ended up with my, my bachelor's in business administration and a few other certificates and stuff like that. So what was it that really drew you in? Because it, it seems to me like from the first time I interacted with you at S B D C that you were excited to be there and excited to serve in that space. So why? Well, I think it was, it was the combination of being able to serve the community in a really unique way. And then, um, I was, I was really lucky and blessed that the combination of Mike and Terry were there.'cause Terry is actually who hired me. I was actually there way back before Mike Way, um, had got hired. Yeah. So you went through a couple, three Yeah. Before Mike came along. But, um, by the time Mike came along and kind of got settled in his role and stuff, um, between him and Terry, they were really. Open and encouraging to letting me kind of explore and do some things within the sbdc. Mm-hmm. Um, and really explore some of my marketing chops and things like that. Right. So all of that sew sewing, I mean, they had a social media presence for the first time because of you really? Yeah. And so when you think about some of my experiences with sewing and dance and everything like that, those are all very highly creative pursuits. Um, but I also love spreadsheets and data. Um, and so I have this highly analytical and highly creative part of my brain that can really go well for marketing. Yeah. Because you have to understand the data that's driving all of these creative pursuits and how those two things kind of go back and forth from marketing Well, and the, and the feelings, the under, you know, understanding people's perspectives and empathizing with what their needs might be and whatnot. Yeah. And then being able to quantify that towards some action that's gonna drive, you know, a business. Um, so all of those things, it was just, it was a really good fit for my personality and, and my brain and the way I work. Yeah. Uh, and plus, you know, Mike and Terry are amazing to work with. So Lisa, same kind of path. What was, uh, what was your why in, in, in how, even in approaching the E East Colorado S B D C, was that something that you were directing toward, or the opportunity just kind of fell upon you? No, it, it just kind of fell upon me. So, um, I was taking a class, you know, my last semester, small business counseling at the Montford College of Business. And, um, it was the first class where we took the theories that we learned during our education at U N C and we applied it to a real business in the community. And, you know, with my experience with my dad owning his business, I really gotta experience, like, you know, I can take these theories and help these small business owners. And they don't have to pay for anything. How great is that? Right. You know? Um, so I think that's where, you know, I, I got called by my, um, he was my professor at the time, and he said, hi, is this Lisa? And I said, yes. Who is this? And introduced himself and he's like, oh, it's Dick Pickett. Um, I want you to come in for an interview this afternoon. And I said, oh, okay. For what? Um, you know,'cause I didn't, I, he had introduced the SBDC during the class, but not, not in depth and. So I had an interview at three o'clock that afternoon, and I had a career set in motion by seven that night. Wow. Yeah. And I just haven't left because obviously I just love it. I mean, we get to help people with what they're most passionate about and make it their every day. I mean, there's nothing there. Right, right. When you can see somebody take, take an idea and turn it into a, a job creating machine. Yeah. Even, uh, a wealth creating machine sometimes. Mm-hmm. Like, it's amazing feeling. Mm-hmm. Tell me about your progression a little bit. So I assume you started as kind of a, a intern gopher girl, kind of, yeah. Mark, mark marketing emphasis, I suppose. Maybe, I don't know. Yeah. So I started as a marketing consultant, you know, with my education at U N C I was helping business owners understand marketing, you know? Okay. A small business owners come in, they're great at their craft, whatever it is in their business. Yeah, they're great at that. But sometimes the other hats that you have to wear as a small business owner, right. You might not have those points. Well, marketing's been evolving for a long time. Yeah. And so I would really help them, you know, develop marketing plans, help strengthen their brand. Online presence was a huge thing, even 13 years ago. Mm-hmm. Um, and so that's really what I focused in on from, um, about 2010 until 2012. And then at 12, um, I became the associate director. Oh. So I started taking on, you know, more management role. Understanding the budget, dipping my tone of fundraising, which hering the cats, which a big part of our job. Um, you know, and just learning more about that side of it. Yeah. Tell me about that, the fundraising element.'cause I, I think about, you know, we've got the, the S B A fund some mm-hmm. I assume for you also. Mm-hmm. And then does Mumford College of Business Fund some mm-hmm. And then you're like knocking on banks doors and things like that. Oh yeah. I have no shame. I, uh, will introduce myself and then ask for money, so, um, but, you know, I really feel like the, the stories, well, if looking it, why wouldn't you? Yeah. The stories we can tell with these small business owners that we're helping has such an impact on our communities. Um, and so, You know, we do get a base grant from the SS b A and then our hosts chip in, but it doesn't cover our budgets. Yeah. So we have to do a lot of fundraising out in our communities to support the contractors that are helping the small business owners. So, um, like I said, no shame, but yeah, we're, we're always fundraising should have like an f c A model where you're, your consultants have to fundraise their own pay. Oh, that might change things. Little interesting. Yeah. A little sticky probably. Katt, talk to me about that from your perspective. Is it the same, uh, with the Loveland City of Loveland and the Chamber kind of element, but then also banks and whatever? Yeah, it is very much the same. Um, I do it on a much smaller scale. Sure. Um, because usually I'm looking for support for individual programs or events and things like that from our, our partners. But, um, man, the relationships that we have with our bankers are, Absolutely incredible. Yeah. Um, I get, I would say probably half of the calls that I get from new clients or potential clients are direct referrals from banks. Oh, that's great. Like, they're like, oh yeah, so and so over at Wells Fargo, so and so over at, you know, US Bank, so and so over at, um, F M B O. They all, they said, they said, I needed to call you when I came to, I came to set up my business bank account and they found out I didn't have a business plan, and they said, I need to call you. And why do they do that? Are you out there hustling and making sure they know that you're there and stuff? Or it's just kind of community knowledge at this point? It's, it's the relationships. Yeah. Yeah. I do a whole lot of networking and showing up to events just so that they know that I'm there and that the L B D C is there, that the SS B D C is supporting that in a larger way and that, you know, we're here as a resource for our businesses. I'm kind of embarrassed actually, because I came out of a 15 year career in banking and. I rarely get referrals from bankers. I really need to work on that more. It's sad and dumb really. Um, and like where does it go from here? Like organizationally, is there any big changes afoot for any of your BDCs or the relationship they're in? Not for East Co. I mean, we had a big change last September when we added seven additional counties. Um, so that was big. Oh, they closed the south thing or something like that, or merged out? Yeah, they merged into East Coast. Yeah. Um, you know, they were looking for a new host and, um, east Coast stepped up. You know, u n UNC has been a very strong host for the last, I think, gosh, 15 years, maybe 16 years. Um, so that was a big change for us last September, gosh, a year. I can't believe there. Well, and culturally like the, the Arkansas Valley and stuff mm-hmm. And Weld County are, have a lot of more similarities and differences, I suppose. Yeah, I would say so. I mean, Eastern Colorado, it's, it's very similar across the plains. I mean, everyone has their own personality, you know. Sure. Um, but I, I think the businesses, even across the state, they're experiencing similar issues. Um, and there's a lot of opportunity to, to help them across the state. And, uh, I don't think we mentioned it earlier, but this Colorado S B C network is huge. Mm-hmm. There's over 300 consultants across the state. Oh, wow. And with the virtual setting that we have in place since the pandemic, you can access any of'em. Oh, is that right? Oh, I didn't realize that. I thought it was very.'cause historically it was very constrained. If you're in winds, you know, across Weld County line in Windsor, you can't come to Larimer County kind of thing. But now you can, or at least virtually, virtually. So if, if we have a client and they're seeking, you know, specialty advice Yeah. And there's a co a consultant on the Western slope, we could bring them in on a consultation. Cool. Yeah. Yeah. That's great to know. I didn't, I really didn't realize that at all. Yeah. One of the areas that I know that we don't have a whole lot of direct support for here in Northern Colorado, is it consulting, but Pikes Peak, Colorado. Um, the Pikes Peak has B D C Outta Colorado Springs has a very robust cybersecurity program so we can get our clients connected with them. So yeah, that's great. I mean, in terms of the changes to the programs, I think that's one of the most, um, The largest changes in the last couple of years, especially like Lisa said, since the pandemic. Um, and then, you know, through a lot of the work of Hope, uh, in Larimer we're doing a lot larger programs. Um, so rather than doing these one-off classes where it's a couple of hours, you come in, you get a data dump, um, and then you go about your merry way. We're doing longer format classes over several weeks, um, that are specialized towards different stages of business, different industries. Yeah. Things like that. The Online Restaurant Academy is amazing. Um, leading Edge has been rebooted, so that's a nice long eight week program. Yeah. Um, so that people are getting not only the class time, but they're getting it interspersed with consulting and it's, it's a lot more effective for that long-term growth and retention. Totally. For our business owners. I think about, uh, Sandler training has a tagline that's like, you don't learn how to read or ride a bicycle at a workshop. Yeah. You know, you gotta do it some and then come back and learn more. Yeah, exactly. Fair enough. Um, is, are there other things that we should talk about in regards to what people need to know about the S B D C land here in northern Colorado and eastern Colorado? I don't know about Lisa, but I just feel like still, so I've been in the community for 11 years. Yeah. And I first found out about the S P D C during a startup week. I was a ment, I was in the software industry at the time, recruited to be a mentor for startup week. Mm-hmm. And I was sitting at a table next to Mike, the former director Oh. Of SS B D C. Oh, wow. So that's how I found out about it. And I was like, oh, what a great, you know, resource. I found out they were housed at the Inosphere and I had been at the Inosphere, I used to go to innovation after Sure. All this stuff. Right. But it's, and, and it's. You were talking earlier about like who's appropriate to come to the event and what about those like high tech, high growth companies? And the thing is, there's pockets in our community and little networks. Yeah. So if you're trying to raise hundreds of thousands of dollars or millions of dollars, you're gonna go to a certain network. Right. But anyways, every week there are people that do not know about the S B D C. Yeah. And I'm like, man, and I, I get really like, we gotta eat our own dog food. Like we need to mark it. Differently or more or something. How do people not know? Yeah, it's been here for 35 years. Right? How do people not know? And so I think with the pandemic, all the positives are all the virtual, it makes it accessible for people. You know, I start, I don't serve, it's virtually free. Right. Even the classes and workshops are cost 80 bucks for a three day workshop or something. Yeah. But it's really like, um, the landscape has changed. People have changed since the pandemic behavior has changed. The way we deploy education, we have to stay current and relevant and accessible. However, people are still hungry to connect in person. Mm-hmm. So for me it's learning that balance of, look, I've been an entrepreneur, I've had companies, if I need something, I find it and I can find it for free. Yeah. Yeah. So we're gonna have things, more things on demand that people need. But figure out, like Kat talked about the programs, when people are willing to show up and commit for multiple weeks, there's something they're looking for and there's a place for it all. Nice. Um, so that's what I at least view happening in Larimer. We're considered more of an urban center. Sure. So it's very different from the mm-hmm. Some of the rural communities that Yeah. And business is, business is business. Yeah. You know, it's people, it's marketing, it's growth. Um, so I'm excited for that. Um, I think we're gonna take a short break and then we'll come back and do some of the closing segments. Sounds good. So, uh, by the time this podcast gets published, the early bird pricing will be over. Uh, but again, it's October 10th. And what's the, what's the day rate on that? It's a hundred bucks, a hundred dollars, a hundred dollars to come to the compress. Uh, move your microphone a little closer to that hope. Um, and then, um, the other thing I wanted to mention is, oh yeah. If you're listening to this podcast now and, you know, a business owner and particularly a women, women business owner, um, forward this to them, they might not know, like you didn't know hope about all the great things that the, the various BDCs offer in this region. Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. So now everybody's favorite, the closing segments. Um, and I'm gonna focus on again, on, on Kat and Lisa, hope you just get to watch these girls squirm, uh, as we talk about faith, family, or politics. And again, uh, I'll give, and we're gonna talk about all three. So where would you like to start and who would like to start? Kat, you're, you're, you're, you're getting eye contact, so that means you want to, okay. So, uh, well, I guess what's, what's the question? What's my answering starting prompt here? Yeah. Uh, just observations on faith, family or politics, and, we'll, we'll go back and forth a little bit with you and Lisa. So which would you be your preferred topic to start with? Well, I, I love talking about my family. Okay. I've, I've got a great family. I've got an insane amount of nieces, nephews, great nieces and nephews. Again, I'm the youngest of five, so like an insane amount. Like are we talking a dozen more? I've, I've got more than a dozen nieces and nephews. Great nieces and nephews. Wow.'cause my nieces and nephews again, I've got that really weird. Split in my family where we've got this huge age range. Yeah. Um, so I've got nieces and nephews that are closer in age to me than the majority of my siblings. Right. Um, so it makes for a really interesting family dynamic sometimes. Do you ever get together as a whole family? Quite a bit. We, we do. Um, not as much as we used to before the pandemic. And also I've got aging parents, so there's some issues with that, uh, where it's harder to, to get everyone in one house, especially when we've got, you know, when it's just me and a couple of my siblings and stuff, it's easily a dozen people, uh, by the time they bring their spouse. Right, right. And their kids Yeah. And everything like that. So that's fun. Um, but we do get together on a really regular basis and, and that's something that's always been really important to me. Yeah, fair enough. Um, yeah. Um, and anything you wanna say about your, your mom or dad, I guess, as they, uh, nurtured all these littles and now in their later years? Oh man, I. I'm lucky'cause I feel like, you know, and especially in talking to my siblings, um, I got the best of both sides of my parents. Um, my mom could walk into a room and know half the people there immediately, and if she didn't know them, she would know them by the time she left. And so she took me along with her to all of these different events. I remember going to like planning meetings for conferences like this, uh, when I was, you know, eight years old. And it was like, man, how you sit there, you color, you read, you behave yourself. Right? But you know, the whole time I'm listening and absorbing Yes ma'am. No ma'am. All that. And everyone's like, your daughter is so polite. And I'm like, I'm gonna get hurt if I don't. No. But it was, it was fantastic growing up like that because I saw that Well, those a chances to interact with Yeah. Grownups and that talk to you like you're a grown up too. Exactly. And so like anytime now professionally that I have people that are like, I am so sorry, my childcare fell through. I need to bring my kid along to this meeting. Is that okay? Right. I'm like, absolutely. Because I think that it's really important for kids to be able to see adults and especially their parents interacting in adult environments. Yeah. Because so often you don't realize that your parents are people. Right. Yeah. Until you're much older. I know a lot of people that, that didn't realize that their parents were whole humans until they were, you know, until their twenties and stuff. Yeah. But I, I knew that from watching my mom as much as I did. Oh, that's really cool. Uh, and then, and then my dad with his intellectual pursuits and everything, because he was a very intellectual man. Um, You know, and as a student Yeah. The passion for learning and you know, um, you know, you mentioned faith as part of that, he was always very open to investigating other faiths and sharing that with us as kids to, to give us that perspective that not everyone believes exactly as you do. And I think that that's really, really important that we go into our lives, understanding that we don't all believe the same thing, but it doesn't mean there's not commonalities there. Right. Yeah. In terms of, you know, love and trust and, and fellowship and things like that. So, agree. Agree. Thank you. That's great, Lisa. Yeah. Would you like to talk about family? Sure. Um, I've got a lot of family growing up here in northern Colorado. Um, we are the family that usually hosts Christmas. We have like 30 people come to our house. Wow. So lots of people around. I've got littles. I've got a five, four, and two year old. Oh, wow. Yeah, we're in the thick of it right now, man. You are, man. You're, um, and they, they broke his own coverage now too, so. Oh yeah. No longer man-to-man. It is zone. Um, it's a hard, tricky zone sometimes, but my oldest, he started to kinder this year, and so he's just so excited. Um, my daughter's in preschool and my little guy, he's, uh, in daycare, so, and you, you must have fallen in love somewhere along the way here. Yeah. Were you already, uh, in your career path before you found this fella? Um, right at the beginning actually, I, we met while I was at U N C, um, and started dating and. Um, dated for quite a long time. We dated for about five years before we got married. Um, make sure we were ready. Right. Um, and, uh, he now works at the city of Fort Collins for connection. Oh, wow. Yeah. Okay. So he's in the fiber world, kind of tech and that sort of thing. Um, but uh, we moved to Windsor and just love it in this area. Yeah. Oh, that's nice. Yeah. Easy commutes for both of you. Definitely. Right in the middle, like literally to the mile. You're like, what, what this neighborhood? Well, no. Then you'd be closer to your work. Yeah. Yeah. It was a negotiation. We, uh, we always do one word description of the children. Oh goodness. Would you like to challenge, uh, tackle that challenge with, with your, your smalls? Mm-hmm. Um, I think my oldest would be curious, and this is a boy is his name, boy Jacob. Yep. Um, right now his favorite word is y. So very curious. Um, my daughter's spicy. I like it. I like it. She's the three year old. Uhhuh. Oh, she's four? Yeah, four. Um, you know, she will run the world someday. Um, and my youngest, she's a boy, just sweetheart. He is so tender. Yeah. It's nice when the, the youngest one is the easiest in some ways, huh? For now? For now. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. For now. So he's, he's, he's still two. So once he gets to that three, he might take over the spicy. Is he chatter boxing quite a bit. Oh my gosh. Yeah. He's coming up with words every day. I'm like, how do you know that? It's wild. I love it. Yeah. Um, would you like to lead us off in either the, uh, faith or the politics segments? Hmm. I mean, either one of those would be fine with me. Um, I. You know, as far as faith goes, I, I support those that have whatever they wanna believe in, but I'm, I'm a bit agnostic in that department. Okay. Didn't, didn't have it in your background as you were raised, things like that. Yeah. You know, my mom, she was, um, went to church most Sundays and I tag along and, you know, I got into F C A for a while, um, during my school years Yeah. Where the Christian boys are and stuff. Yeah. Um, but, uh, you know, it's just, Not something that I, I believe in, nor disbelieve in. And I, I support all walks of life in that. Yeah. Yeah. Haven't pursued, uh, that, that curious thing. No. Maybe your, maybe your boy will, uh, ask you some questions that spend you exploring with him. Yeah. Well, you know, we, we have, we had two dogs. We, and now down to one, and my daughter last night, she asked me, well, where do you go when you die? And I was like, oh, no, this is starting already. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, um, I think that's just part of parenthood too, is figuring out ways to answer the hard questions. For sure. For sure. Mm-hmm. All right. Hard question for you, Kat. What are you, what are you taking from that faith perspective? I mean, I'm, I'm with Lisa in that I'm pretty agnostic as well. I don't subscribe to any one particular faith. Um, you know, most of the time I was presented with a whole lot of different ideologies growing up. Again, my dad, you know, he was a psychotherapist, so he had books on, um, Hinduism, Jainism, Buddhism, um, Judaism. Right. All of these different faiths and stuff that he presented me when I was probably way too young. Right. And was your mom from kind of a traditional Catholic Latina background? Yep. So my mom's definitely got the, the Hispanic Catholic specifically because that's different than other types of Catholic, I feel like, um, where it does bring in some of the indigenous faith roots mm-hmm. Into her beliefs and her practices. Um, so I got these really two. Different, um, explanations of faith. Was that, was that ever a challenge between your parents to have these two kind of divergent, or, that was not really, I mean, wasn't significant between them anyway? No, it really wasn't. And, and the way that they raised all of us kids was, you know, respect. Yeah. And, and trust and hard work. And, and that was more important than, you know, uh, who you pray to or how you pray, or anything like that. Fair enough. My, uh, my home is only like three blocks away from the, the Spanish church downtown, kind of, and they have the best weddings and parties and things like that. And like, I, I ride my bicycle by there sometimes, or, or even out for a walk and I'm just like, you know, I wouldn't understand anything, but I really wanna be a part of this event right now. You crashing the church at us are one of the best. Things I think ever and, and, and one of the things that's interesting to me, especially about quinceaneras is that they really are faith rooted. Um, a lot of people see it as a glorified sweet 16, but no, it's not. It's, it's stepping in to your community as a woman of faith. Oh, interesting. It's really what it's supposed to be about. Oh, okay. I didn't tell, tell me, tell me, what is that name again? Uh, quinceanera, it happens on a girl's 15th birthday. Oh, okay. And usually there's a big party and stuff that happens with it, but really the roots are in the church and that you're stepping out as a woman into the community. Interesting. Is there a boy similarity thing? No, not that I'm aware of. Oh, ing Oh, I had no idea. No, but so it's kind of like the opposite. Well, it's a, the, the girl version of a briss or whatever, or No, not a briss. What are the teenage Jewish boys do something? Mitzvah Mitzvah. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, um, alright, well here we go to politics. Uh, and let's see, oh, lots of, uh, indictments and mugshots and stuff like that going on fresh here. Um, like, that's what I wanna talk about is predictions for the 2024 election. Oh my gosh. Who's gonna be the candidates? Honestly, like I, I came across some kind of eclipse or something the other day of, of the Republican debate and stuff, and. I was like, oh my gosh, this is happening already. Like the elections are already starting, right? And I was like, oh, I have not been paying attention like I probably should be. Well, it's wild sauce right now. I think. Yeah, I mean, Biden is apparently gonna run for reelection. It seems highly unlikely that he makes it to the ticket. Uh, without being bumped by somebody. And then, like, it's hard for anybody to beat Trump in the primary, even if he's in jail probably. But it's, I have no idea what's gonna happen. I really don't. Yeah. Lisa, you have some insights for me. Yeah. That seems kind of like the wild West as far as politics go. And, um, I don't know. One person said this to me, you know, I think it was last month and she was referencing Colorado as a whole, and she's like, well, you know, we're pretty purple. And I didn't make the connection that she was talking about politics. I was like, well, like Purple Mountains Majesty. Okay. And, um, she was like, no, like politically. And I was like, oh, I kind of like that. And I, I think I identify as kind of purple, you know? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, liberal in some aspects and conservative in some others. Would you carry to elucidate? I think, I don't know. I think socially I have a more of a liberal standpoint. Sure. But financially I'm a bit more So you're closet libertarian, just like have a stand maybe? Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. Well, the problem with, with libertarians is there's no money in it. Like Yeah. Fair. If you can't really pull the strings of power for personal gain mm-hmm. Than what, then what are you supposed to do with that? Mm-hmm. Silly hope. What are your election predictions? Oh my gosh. Because I know how much you love talking about benefits. I think, you know, we've gone over this because I, it's one of those things I just really don't talk much about. It's a fascinating season right now though. It is. I mean, I have been tuning into the news and I'm like, my goodness, you know, what's gonna happen next? But right now, I, I don't see any candidates that are really popping out to me. It's, it's a concern. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and I think also just, I mean, you all know this, I'm in an interracial marriage and it's like when, when you go outside of this country, people are like, they think we're all crazy. Totally. Well, ever since 2016 at least. Yeah. They're like, I'm like, those are the two candidates people are choosing from that. It's tragic. Mm-hmm. Well, and we destroy everybody that is willing to serve. Yeah. Mm-hmm. You know, and not even on a national scale, but even local politics and things like that, it's a mm-hmm. You know, it's a, a fool's game almost in some ways. And as I was having a conversation with Martin Lind, uh, and I was like, Martin, why don't, why don't you get into politics sometimes? And like, well, why would I ever do that when they're so affordable to buy? I mean, he's not wrong, unfortunately. So, um, should we talk about local politics? Uh, like in terms of, we've had a lot of, in Fort Collins here, you know, movements toward local minimum wages and things like that. There's a lot of, and even on a state or regional, there's a lot of, uh, new. Protectionist policies for labor that make it harder to say yes to being a business owner sometimes. Any thoughts on that? I mean, I'll just sort of echo a little bit of some of the conversations I was involved in even last year where it's like when people were looking at, um, the minimum wage thing and it's like, you know, there's people with good intentions, but they don't always understand the ramifications it has to small, like how we define small business. And we know that big government definition of 500 employees or less, right? But we're, we're talking more micro business, less is what we see five or less. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So when you mandate something like that, it could literally crush a small business. Um, so it is concern some of the, the policies that come up. And then also we're nonprofits, but we have a very healthy nonprofit community, at least in Fort Collins, I would dare say, across Larimer County. Um, but some of those. Policies would apply to them as well. And that's where you have groups of mostly volunteers. And so, you know, you, some of those changes would shut down a lot of our local businesses, which would affect the fabric of the communities that we love so much. So anyhow, and I think it's more than just the minimum wage too though. I mean, our small business owners are competing with these big box stores on the benefit side, right? Mm-hmm. You know, of what they can offer their employees, um, serving such a, you know, rural area. We're finding communities getting really creative to be able to stay open. We've got some restaurants out east that are sharing employees and they're saying, okay, restaurant A, you're open Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, restaurant B, you're open the rest of the week. Wow. And the employees work at both places, so that way they can all stay open. Yeah. Yeah. That really is a good illustrator of kind of the labor challenge right now. Mm-hmm. And one of my friends the other day was observing that. You know, why we have a labor shortage is'cause nobody does anything for themselves. You know, those people pick up your dog poop and mow your lawn, they roof your house, clean out your gutters, wash your windows, wash your car, and we just don't have enough people to do all those things if we don't like to do anything for ourselves. Might be a continuing challenge. Yeah. Kat, any uh, other thoughts on the regional? I mean, when it comes to local politics, I think that in general, people need to pay attention to it more than they do. Mm. I I am not looking at the 2024 presidential election because I'm looking at what's gonna happen in Loveland and in Larimer County. Yeah. Mayor November, the mayor's race, the city council, yeah. This November. That's gonna affect my community because those are things that, you know, um, it can limit or encourage growth. Um, housing issues, um, not just wages, but the housing piece of it too has to be part of these conversations, right. And understanding what's going on at your local level. And each community is so vastly different in what they're doing. Um, even just between, if we look at the, the major cities in the area and we look at love in Fort Collins and Greeley, like, what's happening in city council, in those different communities right? Is very, very different. And so understanding that as a business owner, I think is really important. And it's something that in, in my role with L B D C, because I am housed with the chamber and everything like that, I, I see that a lot more. Yeah. Um, and, and how that affects our business owners, uh, than I did even when I worked at the Lerer S B D C, because you're kind of a little bit removed from that process. Um, yeah. I think that's a good microcosm of, you know, Northern Colorado can all be friends, right? Yeah. They can, they, we are a united thing and we contend and contest against each other for those business locations, for those choices. Mm-hmm. I was listening to a podcast this morning that, um, 176 significant financial firms have left the state of New York since 2020, uh, and a trillion dollars in assets. Wow. And so, like, if New York loses its mystique as a financial center, What the hell else is it? Mm-hmm. Basic would be like, it could be a, a Detroit Spiral in New York City. Mm-hmm. I think it's very possible and it really just an illustration of how much local politics matters, you know? And, and New York City will drag down a lot of New York state because of that too, because all those feeder communities, so mm-hmm. Hold your breath. Mm-hmm. Uh, don't hold your portfolio if it's in New York. Anyway, I digress, but I had no idea the magnitude of departures. That's a lot. Yeah. And it could be just the tip. Um, the low-code experience is everybody's favorite segment. Um, hope you were on about a year ago. Yeah. I feel like I wanna summarize so they know like where we went with that. I don't remember. Oh, okay. I can summarize. Remind, I'll, I'll just say a sentence. Naked on a beach on New Year's. Oh, yes. Oh my gosh. So top that, Lisa. I don't think I can, what? I think we need to hang out on the weekends more. Find out more about you, lady. Oh, I thought you wanted to be naked on a beach. More. Just kidding. I told you I don't, I don't do that anymore. Anymore. I do remember that. Um, Lisa, I think, I think you got something. I don't know. So this could be a moment. It could be a day in the life. It could be whatever's a crazy experience. It could be something with your kids, your, your husband. Gosh. Um. I mean, I don't have anything like that, but an experience that's going to stick with me for my, for a lifetime, you know, is, um, when I got married to my husband, we did it in, um, as a destination. Um, so, you know, all of my life, I've really been by intrigued by travel. And, um, I did a study abroad program in Guadalajara, Mexico. Oh, cool. And, um, so when we finally made the decision, after five years of dating to get married, we, um, we got married in Paris, France, and Oh wow. Um, the day before the wedding, we were doing a video shoot and, um, my sister was curling her hair in my room for some reason. And the curling iron caught fire Oh, in, in the hotel room. Not her hair, though. Not her hair, um, lit the vanity on fire. Oh. And my dress and his suit were both in the room. Oh. Um, so I almost, uh, wore a charred dress to my wedding, um, in Paris at Christian Dior's home. So, oh, it didn't happen. It was fine. Um, didn't even smell of smoke, so everything was fine, but I guess that would be fairly intense. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of thoughts going through your mind at that moment. Well, she met up with us later and she's like, Hey, um, just so you know, there was a small fire and I was like, a haha very funny. And she's like, no, I'm serious. Don't set hot curling irons on the wood. Yeah. We go, oh man. Wow. Well, Kat, you, you seem like you might have a several local experiences to me. Yeah, I've, I've got a lot of'em, a lot of road trip stories and stuff. Um, just over the years. But I think some of the, some of the stories that always stand out the most to me are, are dancing. Oh.'cause I did dance for so long and everything, and I think one of the, one of the, there were two, two experiences dancing that really stand out to me because, um, again, my mom was always making sure that I was at every practice, at every performance, everything like that. And there's this one dress that's called the Veracruz dress. Okay. It's a white laced dress. Right. And we did very specific dances from the Veracruz region of Mexico. Mm-hmm. Cool. Um, in these dresses. And when I was a kid, I used to get bloody noses really easily, right? Mm-hmm. Because it's very dry in northern Colorado. We don't have a lot of humidity. We're performing in the middle of summer and stuff like that. Yeah. And I remember I like brought my hand up, like with the dress and it like brushed my nose just barely brushed my nose. My hand did, but it caused a bloody nose in the middle of my performance. Oh gosh. Where I have this whitely dress on. Oh gosh. And like I feel it stir and I'm like, I grab my nose and I run off stage and my mom's like, why are you not on stage? And I'm like, my nose, I'm like, holding blood in my hand. And she's like, oh my God. I did not get any on my trust. Wow. So that was, that was pretty fantastic. That was probably about 11 or 12 years old. And then, uh, when I was, I remember when I was 13, so Cinco, my own Greeley is a really big deal, right? Mm-hmm. You get a lot of people that go out and they wanna see the, the ballet folk politico dancers, right? Mm-hmm. And they always put us on the main stage and stuff. And 13 is at an age where you are easily mortified. Okay, sure. So I'll preface this with that. And I am out there and I am dancing and you know, because of the style of Dr dance and dress and everything, we wore bloomers. So they're these shorts that are ruffled and they go down to your knee and they are super, super, super attractive. Right. Um, but I am dancing and it's middle of the day, peak time. There is a ton of people there. There has to be at least 600 people there. And I know that my teachers are there, friends from school, family members, everything. And my dress in the back flips up somehow'cause the wind caught it and then it got caught on one of my bobby pins in my hairpiece. So it is caught and stuck. And, and the backside of your bloomers are showing for everybody. Yes. So that was. I, I was very glad that Cinco, the Mayo happens near the end of the school year because, oh God, that was more funny. So, I mean, that's just a couple of my random experiences with dancing. I love dancing. It taught me so much. But man, there were those kinds of things that happened that were just like, oh yeah, that's character builder right there. Yep. Nothing's gonna be, uh, you know, so if you misspeak at a woman's conference or something like that, it's not as bad as running off stage with your bloomers showing behind you. Right. Exactly. Exactly. So, um, any last questions or your observations for your host today? Well, what's your local experience? Oh, I, you know, I've got so many, um, I, let me think about one, I, you know, one I haven't told yet. Mm-hmm. Uh, probably my first one was, um, a road rage incident in, uh, Morehead, Minnesota. And, I, I'll be kind of briefer than I have to be about it, but I, there was a, a Ford pickup, a guy, uh, with this gal in a Ford pickup, and he wanted to, he was like zooming up and trying to squeeze in in front of me. And I was like, I'm turning left. And dude, you didn't have to like, oh, he was behind me then swerved out and then wanted to inject himself in front of me. So I kind of cut him off and eventually he was like, persuasive enough. I was like, okay, fine. And I give him the bird and he comes to a complete stop on this two-lane highway headed from Fargo to Morehead and like I from 50 and I bumped his car and coming to a stop and I'm dropping my girlfriend off at Pizza Hutt. Oh gosh. And he gets out of the car and comes back to um, like accost me basically. And I'm like, dude, it's fine. But cars are like going around us on the shoulder. I'm like, let's pull our cars off the side of the road if you want to talk about this, whatever. And. He tries to grab me physically and pull me outta the car. And I was able to, to block that. And then he goes up to get his cell phone out of the truck. And in the meantime I'm like, fuck this. And so I'm like backing up and going forward to get my car ready to go around his truck and G T F O and he sees what I'm doing when I just, at the time I get, um, free. And so he comes and stands in front of me and he's like, we're gonna get the cops here. And I bumped the back of his bumper, it scratched my car. There was no damage to him. And he like, He's standing there in his person. And so I'm like, well, my car's bigger, so I bump him a little bit and because he is already attacked me, kind of, and I'm like, I'm just gonna be gone dude. Just like, time for you to go. And he, you know, and I bump him again and he's now screaming pretty loud. And then he comes back around inside of the car and really tries to rip me outta the car this time. But I'm already in gear. So I like start idling going around his car and he's running alongside screaming at me and I get onto the highway and hit second gear and my five speed Grand Prix. And he flies off and tumbles down the highway. And uh, yeah, he was a maniac. Oh my gosh. And he's got this like 90 pound. A probably meth head girl in his truck and she jumps out of the truck. And so I gotta go drop my girlfriend off yet. So I go, go back and he, she's like running across the meeting of this highway trying to get in front of me and I cruise past her, go to the back way, drop my girlfriend off, go to the police department in Moorhead, and they're like, oh yeah, that guy, he's a volunteer fire department guy and he's been a powder keg for years. Oh. And do you wanna press charges? I'm like, no, I, and I don't want him to know who I'm or anything. And I never heard another thing about it. Wow. But yeah, he like went off the deep end on the road rage and I, I guess I encouraged him with flipping'em off and bumping him and stuff. But like little Christmas vacation. Yeah. It was a main, it was a, it was, it was my first interaction with somebody that was just completely. And effectively irrational that couldn't be reasoned with that was, you know, had a, an agenda apparently. And I was like, I was lucky to get outta there, you know, without injury. Wow. Wow. So that was one, that was my first one chronologically that I can remember anyway. Yeah. Like the brush of death. I know. That's sometimes your low co just Googling brush. Yeah. Yeah. I don't too many. Yeah. But anyway, that's one. Wow. Good one. I've got lots of them. You had no idea what you were asking Lisa. No, I'm glad I did though. Glad I did. The uh, I tell the story of a concert, uh, battle of Sorts, uh, in the Patrick and Jana Soukup one, if you wanna listen to another one. That one. Now you got me hooked to the podcast. Yeah, I hope so. Good for you. Hope so. Well share it with your friends and, uh, and all of you out there, you know, share this episode with an inspire one, just one inspiring business leader that you know, or aspiring. And, uh, that'll do'em well. Thanks ladies. Appreciate you. Thank you, sir. Thank you.